Talking Carlton Index Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington Lochie O'Brien Kerryn Harrington CFC Home CFC Membership CFC Shop CFC Fixture Blueseum
It is currently Sun May 11, 2025 6:50 am

All times are UTC + 10 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 177 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 1:24 pm 
Offline
Harry Vallence
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 11:23 am
Posts: 1797
Location: Half Back Flanker...
aramari wrote:
Here's a reason - we can't recruit talented KPPs to save ourselves.

Pick 24 2004 Hartlett
Pick 18 2005 Bower
Pick 36 2005 Edwards
Pick 18 2010 Watson
Pick 34 2010 McCarthy
Pick 42 2010 Mitchell
Pick 44 2011 Rowe

Apart from Josh Kennedy, our drafting of KPPs with our more valuable picks has been disastrous. Who was the last good KPP taken by us in the first three rounds of the National Draft that wasn't a father-son or a top 5 pick? Brendan Fevola. Before that? NOBODY!

The next best are Minton-Connell '86 and Cook '90. We actually did better drafting talls when we weren't even really trying!

Look at our KPPs that can get a game
White - rookie
Casboult - rookie
McInnes - Pick 67 2010
Jamieson - rookie
Henderson - traded in
Waite - Father-son
Betts - PSD

I haven't written off Watson, McCarthy, Mitchell or Rowe, but that might be because I haven't seen enough of them play. Those that do are not glowing in their praise.


Absolutely agree...and how many of these NB players are happy to stay there?

Why are they not pushing to get promoted? It's not like they are waiting for Silvagni, Fev or Kernahan to retire to play in their positions - those positions has been available for nearly a decade!!

_________________
"...that's the thing about opinion - you don't have to know anything to have one..." Andre Agassi commenting on Pat Cash 2004
"...the less you know - the more you believe..." - Bono 2006


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 5:23 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:27 am
Posts: 33188
Location: In the box.
carntheblues wrote:
What you really consider as average is our recruiting. And everyone knows it is not an exact science. It is easy to pick out the exception at other clubs. If you talk to Essendon* supporters they will complain similarly about their poor recruiting. Maybe instead of Gibbs we should have picked up Gumbleton!

oh so you believe our recruiting has been good...

illustrate it for us.. demonstrate how its been good.. and yes i know it shouldnt be an exact science... but we turned it into an exact science on what not to do... so in our case its an exact science.

gumbleton has been injured....
thats got nothing to do with why watson was picked.. or why we back to backed lucas and watson
and russell
and grigg
and hampson
and bower
and harlett
and rowe

and lurkas

need i go on??

_________________
Due to recent budget cuts and the rising cost of electricity, gas, and oil....... the Light at the End of the Tunnel has been turned off. We apologize for the inconvenience.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 6:01 pm 
Offline
Bob Chitty
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2005 10:50 pm
Posts: 809
heard Kennett the other day rabbit on about the board at the hawks in his tenure, basically lean (6 directors I think), smart and accountable with representation in key areas - legal, finance/commercial, sales etc

what have we got? how does our prez stack up against his peers?

watching Sydney right now and we are light years behind them


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 8:19 pm 
Offline
Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 3:20 pm
Posts: 1806
carntheblues wrote:
What you really consider as average is our recruiting. And everyone knows it is not an exact science. It is easy to pick out the exception at other clubs. If you talk to Essendon* supporters they will complain similarly about their poor recruiting. Maybe instead of Gibbs we should have picked up Gumbleton!



If you troll through the other teams supporter web sites, how many Geelong supporters are divided on the worthiness of J Selwood. Or Richmond supporters on Cotchin or PA on Boak ? All 3 leaders at their clubs and all 3 I would dare say are A graders rated by the whole supporter base. How many Crows fans would be considering a trade for Dangerfield tonight after the flogging?

How did we overlook all of them?

Every other week our supporter base is divided on the worthiness of Kruz, Murph and Gibbs. All are number one picks.We had the option to pick the above names but passed over them for the safe option on all 3 number 1 picks. Would any of Murph or Gibbs or Kruz be considered an A grader? Maybe Murph circa 2011 but he hasnt been able to back it up.
Would Yarran be considered an A grader at pick 6? Would Lucas at Pick 12?
If our supporter base can be used as a the litmus test for how well our recruitment staff have fared in the last 5-6 years , than they have failed miserably. 5-6 years down the track we are still divided on the usefulness of our number one picks.
Yeah, I get the argument that its not an exact science.But how do you manage to divide a supporter base with THREE number one picks? Surely you find just one A grader with that sort of ammunition do you not?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:03 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:04 pm
Posts: 48542
Location: Prison Island
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/spo ... d-schwarz/

lol sticks - how about you worry about your own brains and nous

_________________
*(grow - fun - gah) :fight:

Yeah but whatabout your whataboutism.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 11:19 pm 
Offline
Geoff Southby

Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:29 pm
Posts: 5913
Location: Melbourne
grrofunger wrote:
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/sport/afl/news/stephen-kernahan-whacks-david-schwarz/

lol sticks - how about you worry about your own brains and nous


Hey, when you find someone dumber than you are, it's a godsend.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 9:57 am 
Offline
Vale 1953-2020
User avatar

Joined: Wed May 11, 2005 1:23 am
Posts: 11671
grrofunger wrote:
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/sport/afl/news/stephen-kernahan-whacks-david-schwarz/

lol sticks - how about you worry about your own brains and nous

LOL. Amazing listening. If someone asked me if I thought TFS could sound any stupider than it already does, I think I wouldve said "yeah, just add Danny Frawley to it". Well, there ya go. Is this a regular occurrence?

_________________
Never argue with idiots. They drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!!!

After Monday and Tuesday, even the calendar says W T F .........
Visit http://fromthemoshpit.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:04 am 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6326
Same old same old

For this club to truly move forward the board must be dissolved and a new board for 2014 and beyond needs to come on board. No more than 6 and no more Pratts and Sticks.

it simply has to happen

Just like Geelong did with Costa and Cook

If the right people com in then the club will slowly get better and we will win a flag

we simply havent changed with the times


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:21 am 
Offline
Harry Vallence

Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 1:48 pm
Posts: 1556
Location: Under the Earth`s Sun...now.
C`mon Keogh. There is no better President out there than Sticks. He would have stepped aside remember.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:40 am 
Offline
Craig Bradley

Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:36 am
Posts: 6326
I hope your joking
You are arn't you
Or you simply dont get it

Kernahan doesnt even make decisions
He simply follows the leader
And he is a leader

Look at all the great teams

What did they have in common besides great coaches and players
a great admin
North Alyett
Hawthorn Cook Kennett
Geelong Costa
Collingwood McGuire
Swans Colless
Essendon* McMahon

These guys would run rings around sticks in a meeting

He is too dumb
too unsavy
has been partly responsible for some of the dumbest football decisions that only Melbourne can top

We have been a digrace for the last decade and more
and he is the common barometer

a smart guy knows when it is time to go
we all experienced it at some time
you go when it is time
Sticks time was up 10 years ago
an yet he is still our interim President hanging around like a sulphur fart

Get flower real mate


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:42 am 
Offline
formerly Virgin Blue

Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:40 am
Posts: 1628
Dumb players
Lazy players
Lack of leadership

Here's the thing though. Leadership ought not have to come from the leaders only
Everyone has to step up
Everyone has to take responsibility
Everyone has to play the right card as Mick says
It's a team game
A team effort

All players need to take it upon themselves to ...

- realize bombing long is being countered and therefore an adjustment needs to be made
- put sides to the sword, not take the foot off their throat when you are dominating. It's simple really - if you're on top you've only got yourselves to blame if you end up losing the game
- do what needs to be done to arrest back lost momentum when the opposition have a run on. Hardness, gut running, and smart decisions come into play here

I won't go into individuals in this post
Reality is as a side we are not doing enough


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:54 am 
Offline
Harry Vallence

Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 1:48 pm
Posts: 1556
Location: Under the Earth`s Sun...now.
Keogh, i agree with you.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 11:58 am 
Offline
Stephen Silvagni
User avatar

Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 6:46 am
Posts: 28227
lol


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 12:02 pm 
Offline
Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:56 pm
Posts: 2477
keogh wrote:
Same old same old

For this club to truly move forward the board must be dissolved and a new board for 2014 and beyond needs to come on board. No more than 6 and no more Pratts and Sticks.

it simply has to happen

Just like Geelong did with Costa and Cook

If the right people com in then the club will slowly get better and we will win a flag

we simply havent changed with the times


Agreed.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 12:04 pm 
Offline
Rod Ashman

Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 2:56 pm
Posts: 2477
jenx wrote:
heard Kennett the other day rabbit on about the board at the hawks in his tenure, basically lean (6 directors I think), smart and accountable with representation in key areas - legal, finance/commercial, sales etc

what have we got? how does our prez stack up against his peers?

watching Sydney right now and we are light years behind them


Yes. We are light years behind.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:26 pm 
Offline
Mike Fitzpatrick
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 8:15 pm
Posts: 4842
daggs001 wrote:
carntheblues wrote:
What you really consider as average is our recruiting. And everyone knows it is not an exact science. It is easy to pick out the exception at other clubs. If you talk to Essendon* supporters they will complain similarly about their poor recruiting. Maybe instead of Gibbs we should have picked up Gumbleton!



If you troll through the other teams supporter web sites, how many Geelong supporters are divided on the worthiness of J Selwood. Or Richmond supporters on Cotchin or PA on Boak ? All 3 leaders at their clubs and all 3 I would dare say are A graders rated by the whole supporter base. How many Crows fans would be considering a trade for Dangerfield tonight after the flogging?

How did we overlook all of them?

Every other week our supporter base is divided on the worthiness of Kruz, Murph and Gibbs. All are number one picks.We had the option to pick the above names but passed over them for the safe option on all 3 number 1 picks. Would any of Murph or Gibbs or Kruz be considered an A grader? Maybe Murph circa 2011 but he hasnt been able to back it up.
Would Yarran be considered an A grader at pick 6? Would Lucas at Pick 12?
If our supporter base can be used as a the litmus test for how well our recruitment staff have fared in the last 5-6 years , than they have failed miserably. 5-6 years down the track we are still divided on the usefulness of our number one picks.
Yeah, I get the argument that its not an exact science.But how do you manage to divide a supporter base with THREE number one picks? Surely you find just one A grader with that sort of ammunition do you not?



Yes, you back up your disappointments with leftfield successes, we don't so much and that has a lot to do with lack of planning. By that I mean an inability to 'read' the draft and have a healthy draft presence in terms of the number of selections and how high. You can guess roughly where certain players are going to fall and what picks you are going to need to secure them. If that means trading a player and taking a slightly lower pick than you think he is worth, then, so be it. I see almost none of that at Carlton and we seem to have a completely fatalistic attitude to the way we recruit.

As for our high draft picks, some of it is bad luck/bad development and some of it is simply a ham-fisted attitude. We need to be more flexible and innovative in the whole process. Whenever the whole trade/draft period is in process, the vibe I get from the club is one of a necessary evil being undertaken. Seriously - if that's the way the club runs, it's no wonder the list has its problems.

_________________
Just because I'm offended, doesn't mean I'm wrong.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:47 pm 
Offline
Bruce Doull
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:23 am
Posts: 48682
Location: Canberra
JohnM wrote:
grrofunger wrote:
http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/sport/afl/news/stephen-kernahan-whacks-david-schwarz/

lol sticks - how about you worry about your own brains and nous


Hey, when you find someone dumber than you are, it's a godsend.


I'm only half way through the audio of that monthly Mensa meeting, but it just amazes me that such a poor quality of discussion is all that's needed to have your own radio show.

_________________
Click here to follow TalkingCarlton on twitter
TalkingCarlton Posting Rules


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 177 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9

All times are UTC + 10 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 118 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group