1999 National Draft.....pick number 40....from Dandenong U18's.....about 120 games and over 80 goals......not a bad pick up.

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No ones listening till you make a mistake.

He was a good pickup.....you can add Matt Allan, Justin Murphy and Campo to Sheedy list of recruiting evils.....

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"When you have the attitude of a champion, you see adversity as your
training partner."
- Conor Gillen

Is Hille a top liner?

I must have the seasons where he was AA and a class ruckman.

You can ad Fev to that list in the same era.

You're spot on. Essendon* have been hanging on in terms of recruiting badly, and old farts into the bargain for years and will no doubt do it again. Fletcher, Hird, Johnsons etc are holding their heads above water but will be gone soon.

They might win 50/50 games but they'll never win a flag that way.

I hope they don't work it out too soon.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/td-essendon-bombers

That a very good point Duke.

At least we know deep down inside that the Bummers are [REDACTED] for at least another 8 years.

I will sleep better now.

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They coud'nt.....could they?

Don't forget Zantuck

I don't mind Monfries.....he has got talent and courage.....Stantons not a bad ball carrier....like a young Campo?..........

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No ones listening till you make a mistake.

Monfries is a top liner. Hille is not. Lovett close. Stanton looks good. Johns may or may not be, but I reckon Sheedy not helping him. Bradley looks too unco, surprised how well he was rated by recruiters.

We're talking about blokes who will shape games for the Bombers, not foot soldiers.

Doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be/are superstars, just that they can stand on their own two feet in the absence of Hird, Lloyd, Lucas, Michael, Fletcher, Johnson, Johnson, Peverill in two years time, because most of those names will be gone.

Further to that, I'm not looking at first & second round picks unless they are truly inspired, and certainly not pricey trades.

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29 different attributes,
And only 7 that you like;
20 ways to see the world,
Or 20 ways to start a fight.

Well he was Captain of the club last year. He seems to do a number on Fraser every time he plays him who was No.1 in that draft. He won them that final against melbourne a few years back , the elimination final I believe. He isnt a superstar but top liners win big games and he has most certainly done that a few times.

Who have we developed in KP or ruck since Pagan came , apart from the obvious one in Fevva , who had the talent anyway?

Stanton is a gun , Monfries looks the goods and as said above , Lovett looks the goods as well.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

Yeah, but is Fraser a top line ruckman? I don't think so.

Well who is then?? He isnt a superstar , but top liner? Yes.

Lade from Port? Sandilands and Cox , but they are superstars. I never said Hille was a superstar but he is a top liner for sure. He'd slot straight into our line up no probs.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

Agreed, Hille is one of the top liner ruckmens going around. He makes a huge difference to the Essendon* side. They don't do very well without him.

He would walk into the best 22 of any side.

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It is not as bad as you are lead to believe.......it is %$#^& worse!!!

Top liner ruckman?

I'd rate Fraser, Sandilands, Ottens, McIntosh, White, Lade, Simmonds, Everitt, Jolly and Cox as better ruckman then Hille.

Dare I say he would absolutely walk into our side?

I was very pleased BTW with Ackland's game on the weekend.

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No ones listening till you make a mistake.

Ottens?? Mr inconsistent.

McIntosh?? Still has alot to prove.

Simmonds? Errr.... no.

Jolly?? You must be trippin.

Fraser?? Gets beaten by Hille every time they play.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

Playing part time in the ruck unlike Hille yet still averages more possessions, hitouts and has kicked more goals than Hille in 2007



McIntosh also averages more possessions and hitouts in 2007 despite only having played 27 games compared to Hille's 113. They have kicked 3 and 4 goals respectively in 2007.



Was almost All Australian last year and has been injured this year. In 2006 he averaged 16 possessions, 18 hitouts and kicked 25 goals.



Jolly averages a similar number of possessions to Hille in 2007 (10 to 11) and 8 more hitouts (23 to 15) despite sharing the ruck duties with Peter Everitt.



You should check your facts before you make such ridiculous claims

Fraser and Hille have come up against each other 7 times. In those 7 games, Hille averages 11 possessions compared to Fraser's 17, they are even in hitouts (Hille ave 16.6 to Fraser's 16.6) while Hille has kicked 8 goals compared to Fraser's 5. I'd hardly call that being beaten every time they play. On the contrary, I'd say Fraser has the better of Hille when they meet.

It is clear that the ruckman which you mentioned as being inferior to Hille are infact equal to or better than him.

I'd take Andrew Cavedon before any of them

err..... dont you mean I should check my STATS not facts. Since when did stats tell the full story? Especially when it comes to ruckmen who tend to influence games more with their bulk and size rather than stats. Alot of big men dont have the disposal to hurt the opposition. Hille doesnt fit into this category though. Hit outs yes , but do you have the info on where the actual tap outs go? Its one thing to get first hand to the ball but it means fook all if it aint going to a teammate.

Heath Scotland racks em up at will , possibly more than Judd and Kerr last year. Does that mean we have the best player in the competition? I hardly think so.

Rather than look at stats , I'd rather look at the big picture.

Now it was well known Hille was carrying an injury in the first 4 rounds. He took 3 weeks off so Im going to judge him on the last 3 weeks. I'm also going to go one step further by going with Champion Data which at least goes some way to showing how effective a players stats really are. If you must use stats , these are the ones to use.

According to those stats , Hille (93 , 85 , 101) beats McIntosh (91 , 94 , 67) , Ottens (105 , 59 , 100) and Jolly (64 , 60 , 141) while Fraser (152 , 90 , 96) has had his measure. Note that Hille has not only outscored the others but has put in much more consistent performances and will improve for the 3 runs hes had. He also has had little support in the ruck.

You can bring up stats on Fraser V Hille but in my eyes , Hille has had his measure , I dont need stats to tell me that. So perhaps YOU should research a bit harder before you bring up pointless stats as an argument. Try watching the game and using that as a reference.

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You want the flame? Give us the marbles!!

To say that Hille is not a top liner....you must really be blinded by the Navy Blue.

Come on guys, I know it is Essendon* but do you really think that if every player that plays for Essendon* is crap then they would be higher on the ladder than us?

Essendon* will be able to build a team around Ryder therefore they are not too far behind as some of you suggest.

Carlton have no standout KPP yet that I am confident we can build a team around, though we are young and youth can bring out a bundle of surprises. There is hope which is more than we have had for a long while.

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It is not as bad as you are lead to believe.......it is %$#^& worse!!!