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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 4:09 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
Posts: 1495
frank dardew wrote:
Question for me re Gresham is why would we want him when he plays in a similar position as cunningham hf who can go in the middle and Cunningham is much cheaper and wont be on as long term contract


How often has Cuningham been on the park?


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 4:11 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:10 am
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Paddycripps wrote:
frank dardew wrote:
Question for me re Gresham is why would we want him when he plays in a similar position as cunningham hf who can go in the middle and Cunningham is much cheaper and wont be on as long term contract


I am not necessarily advocating Gresham to the Blues but right now he is definitely an upgrade on some of our small forwards based on talent - he can play


It's also about depth and options. How many players play 22 games a year now especially with our list?

Cuningham Fogarty have been good recently but they have NEVER put a season together


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 4:31 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17948
Gresham has had a couple of difficult years but he's played 131 games compared to Cuninghams 47.
He wins more of his own ball, plays more footy as a midfielder (effectively) yet has more score involvements than Cuningham. I'm a big fan of Cunners when he's on but he rarely is. He goes missing for large periods of games. Plus he has a career best 4 clearances in a game. Nowhere near good enough for a player of his skillset. Gresham has a career best of 9. Adaptability, consistency and versatility.
If the price is right, I'd take Gresham. Yes we have an abundance of small/mid forwards but very few of them can provide a viable midfield rotation.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 6:55 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24686
Location: Bondi Beach
FarmerBlue wrote:
Paddycripps wrote:
frank dardew wrote:
Question for me re Gresham is why would we want him when he plays in a similar position as cunningham hf who can go in the middle and Cunningham is much cheaper and wont be on as long term contract


I am not necessarily advocating Gresham to the Blues but right now he is definitely an upgrade on some of our small forwards based on talent - he can play


It's also about depth and options. How many players play 22 games a year now especially with our list?

Cuningham Fogarty have been good recently but they have NEVER put a season together


Fair call

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 7:02 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24686
Location: Bondi Beach
Blue Vain wrote:
Gresham has had a couple of difficult years but he's played 131 games compared to Cuninghams 47.
He wins more of his own ball, plays more footy as a midfielder (effectively) yet has more score involvements than Cuningham. I'm a big fan of Cunners when he's on but he rarely is. He goes missing for large periods of games. Plus he has a career best 4 clearances in a game. Nowhere near good enough for a player of his skillset. Gresham has a career best of 9. Adaptability, consistency and versatility.
If the price is right, I'd take Gresham. Yes we have an abundance of small/mid forwards but very few of them can provide a viable midfield rotation.



Its all about his form today, and not so much the past record.

He may have been good, but is he all those things he was?

Are are youth on the way up? When do the youth match Gresham?

At the right price, yeah. What's that?

I was a huge fan of Greshams as a kid, being a Carlton supporter added to the admiration, but he hasnt impressed me this year to the point I see him as an upgrade..

Its a spot. Do we delist a player to make way for him instead or take a speculative pick in the draft? It will a late pick.

There's a lot of moving pieces. Lets see what he's got in the next game and thereafter before going all in on him.

In Austin I trust. He may see things differently. I don't blame him if he does.

We've got a Flag to continue to pursue, this year.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2023 8:28 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17948
bondiblue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Gresham has had a couple of difficult years but he's played 131 games compared to Cuninghams 47.
He wins more of his own ball, plays more footy as a midfielder (effectively) yet has more score involvements than Cuningham. I'm a big fan of Cunners when he's on but he rarely is. He goes missing for large periods of games. Plus he has a career best 4 clearances in a game. Nowhere near good enough for a player of his skillset. Gresham has a career best of 9. Adaptability, consistency and versatility.
If the price is right, I'd take Gresham. Yes we have an abundance of small/mid forwards but very few of them can provide a viable midfield rotation.



Its all about his form today, and not so much the past record.


IMHO, it's about his capability and what he offers next year if we take him. His past record indicates his capability.
He is a proven midfield player who can impact forward. A career best 9 clearances in a game compared to Cuninghams best of 4.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 7:54 am 
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Craig Bradley
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in DC's defence, he's never had any continuity to build any kind of form and gain any kind of experience. he's still building; but gresham is who he is -ie someone the saint's fans are frustrated with, and happy to see leave.

if DC stays healthy, i feel like his ceiling is much higher than gresham's.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 8:19 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24686
Location: Bondi Beach
Quote:
Ben McKay (NM)
Essendon* is in the box seat although his form this season has waned. May only attract a $650,000-a-year offer which would net the Kangaroos an end of first or possibly second-round compensation pick.

Jade Gresham (StK)
Moved from the midfield into a largely forward role this season. Saints happy to keep him at right price, but Carlton firming and can’t rule out Hawks.

Darcy Parish (Ess)
Has already said he wants to stay at Essendon*, so a deal shouldn’t be far away. Parties relaxed about a contract. Probably a $700,000 -a-year player. Geelong had a look.

Tom Doedee (Ade)
Adelaide comfortable the backman will stay off second knee reconstruction. Brisbane linked to him as Lions look around for a third defender to support back half. Crows in pole position. Geelong a wildcard.

Charlie Dixon (PA)
Can’t see him leaving. Loves Ken Hinkley and in a good spot to have a genuine crack at a flag. From Gold Coast originally.


https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/news/afl-trade-news-2023-how-esava-ratugolea-gets-to-port-adelaide-and-what-it-means-for-other-big-deals/news-story/776f7170474183b483a39cfcef58f605

Looks like Gresham is the cheapest of the possibles.

Would prefer Ben McKay if we could afford him

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 8:37 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2006 11:03 am
Posts: 24686
Location: Bondi Beach
Blue Vain wrote:
bondiblue wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
Gresham has had a couple of difficult years but he's played 131 games compared to Cuninghams 47.
He wins more of his own ball, plays more footy as a midfielder (effectively) yet has more score involvements than Cuningham. I'm a big fan of Cunners when he's on but he rarely is. He goes missing for large periods of games. Plus he has a career best 4 clearances in a game. Nowhere near good enough for a player of his skillset. Gresham has a career best of 9. Adaptability, consistency and versatility.
If the price is right, I'd take Gresham. Yes we have an abundance of small/mid forwards but very few of them can provide a viable midfield rotation.



Its all about his form today, and not so much the past record.


IMHO, it's about his capability and what he offers next year if we take him. His past record indicates his capability.
He is a proven midfield player who can impact forward. A career best 9 clearances in a game compared to Cuninghams best of 4.


Good point re what he provides for us next year, but its still related to form, and in this case, hope.

He is a proven midfielder, sure, but youre all you can base that is on previous years because this year he's shown nothing like his form in the past, and hasnt been a hit in the midfield either.

I think he's a forward first and a gives a chop out in the midfield when he makes the team, not the other way around. He may have been a good part time midfielder.

Ive seen his numbers in Footy wire, and those numbers of Gresham's date back to 2021. I've tried to find positives, and watched him closely in the last 2 years because I favour players who barracked for Carlton, but it looks to me He's peaked and His best is behind him imo.

He's on show tomorrow. I'm sure he's on Carlton's radar as a FA, and I'm sure it is with great hope he can find that form from a few years back to take the plunge him.

If he's cheap, its because he's a depth player. I'll take him for depth, but the hard question is would we delist Cuningham for Gresham? We would have 6 weeks ago. Things change.

I don't know the answer, but have a strong feeling that buyer should beware, and if he's more than $350K, I'd pass and keep developing our youth.

Moving deck chairs or moving forward? Personally, I prefer Cuningham, but how can I trust his body? Conundrum.

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 Post subject: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 12:28 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Hard no to Ben MacKay

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 1:30 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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Hard agree


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 1:30 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17948
Braithy wrote:
in DC's defence, he's never had any continuity to build any kind of form and gain any kind of experience.


At 26 years of age, I'm not sure that's really in his defence. :grin:

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 2:10 pm 
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Craig Bradley

Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:04 pm
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Walter - Top 2
Read - Top 10
Rogers - Top 10
Sanders - Top 10
Croft - Top 20
McCabe - Top 20
Cleary - Top 30
Graham - Top 30

All of these kids are in the bidding process with Gold Coast, North, Dogs, Sydney & Hawthorn.

Fair chance our two picks in the 60s land in the early 50s once the dust settles.

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2023 4:20 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Blue Vain wrote:
Braithy wrote:
in DC's defence, he's never had any continuity to build any kind of form and gain any kind of experience.


At 26 years of age, I'm not sure that's really in his defence. :grin:



No, I agree but the fact he lost 2 years in effect because of the knee does cut him some slack. I don't believe we have seen his best.


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2023 8:05 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 3:08 pm
Posts: 3248
No to Gresham - we don’t need him at all


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 Post subject: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2023 8:08 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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He played like a good Carlton supporter should today

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2023 9:53 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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Location: Bondi Beach
london blue wrote:
No to Gresham - we don’t need him at all


I'm glad to hear that london.

I kept looking for something.
Midfield/ Forward, Forward/Midfield...couldn't see where he fits.

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 Post subject: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2023 11:09 pm 
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Wayne Johnston
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Location: Melbourne
Gresham is bang average. Would rather keep what we’ve got on lower coin


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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2023 2:32 am 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:42 pm
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Location: dudley!!!
CK95 wrote:
Hard no to Ben MacKay

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Why is that CK?

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 Post subject: Re: List Management 2023
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2023 8:09 am 
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Craig Bradley
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bender wrote:
CK95 wrote:
Hard no to Ben MacKay

Sent from my Nokia G21 using Tapatalk


Why is that CK?



he's oft injured and not very good or maybe consistent is a better word. has flashes sure, but rarely maintains it.


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