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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:14 am 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
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Blue Revival wrote:
grrofunger wrote:
use waite at CHB when he comes back

!@#$%& Boyd - we need to do everything we can to get a key defender and a whole bunch of midfielders

+1



It would be OK if we played St Kilda every week. Gwilt and Stanley as key defenders at the moment. :eek:

Hendo is a ripper but he has to do the job against quality defenders. Lets not get carried away. From my point of view his work rate is excellent and he always works hard to command the corridor but he struggles to get seperation from the quality defenders. Does he have the strength now to body up the better defenders, time will tell.
As for Rowe, rapt for him but lets see him perform against quality opposition before re-arranging our draft strategies. :razz:
I'm tipping he's still short of consistent AFL standard. As is Casboult, as is Mitchell.
We still need a quality key forward.

The positive for me, we werent having all of our shots from the pockets. Our forwards worked their defenders over with hard running and we then able to lead back into the corridor. Faster ball movement also contributed.
Hence 16.14.

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Last edited by Blue Vain on Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:16 am 
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Ken Hands
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Went to the game last night and braved it. In hindsight, it was a great decision! Good solid win that we needed to have although St Kilda stuffed up many chances in front of goal.

Obviously Judd and Henderson were the standouts, but I liked Scotland's experienced head and body size down back too, helped us out many a time in the rough and tumble of the contest.

We need to still win 5 from 7 to make finals, we lose to North Melbourne next Friday night, then it's season over.

Stick that up your arse St Kilda, you had the umpires on your side the whole night too but still couldn't get over the line, hahaha


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:16 am 
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Harry Vallence

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bluehammer wrote:
All this bullshit about booing Stephen milne. Does anyone in the media realise that he's been booed for years anyway?

Correct. At the game I thought we'd have to lift the roof off and the Etihad staff call a snap strike under occupational health and safety because of the noise for the booing to be significantly greater than the baseline level of Milne booing. It didn't seem beyond baseline to me. Judd got booed by StKilda almost as much. Never been able to figure out the Judd booing thing myself.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:36 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Re judd, eye gouging and chicken winging are probably boo worthy.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 11:44 am 
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Rod Ashman
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Have never understood the Nick Riewoldt booing, it happened a bit last night. Judd was always booed playing for the Blues long before the eye gouging, chicken wing incidents.

Good players often tend to get booed by the opposition fans.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:03 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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bluehammer wrote:
Re judd, eye gouging and chicken winging are probably boo worthy.


Except he was booed before that, certainly before the chicken wing.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:07 pm 
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Garry Crane
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Just throwing this out there - can Henderson and Waite play in the same forward line? They are both much more lead-up forwards than stay-at-home forwards. Hendo and Rowe seemed to work well because Rowe has the ability to mark in a pack a bit, whereas I think Henderson is strong either on a lead or in a one-on-one situation.

What is our best forward combo with our current list? Not just by name, but by play style etc?

I lost count how many times it looked like our midfielders were running into each other and getting in the way of the guy with the ball last night. We can't have that same sort of situation in the forward line too!

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:13 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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ShanDog wrote:
Just throwing this out there - can Henderson and Waite play in the same forward line?!



Don't think we have to worry about it this year as Waite is out for 1 to 2 weeks.

:roll:

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:32 pm 
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Horrie Clover

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idle wrote:
Team looks crap and is playing crap because we've put in some hard yards this season for little return. Losing so many games by such little margins has really taken a toll on their self belief. Tonight was one small step in the right direction in that regard and we'll be all the more better for it.

Also Malthouse is still trying to find a winning formula with this squad. I don't believe for a moment our list is crap. I believe our list is confidence shot, confused and still trying to find the right formula. When it clicks look out!

In 30+ years of football I've seen it too many times. Geelong at one stage were going to sack their coach and their list looked dismal. But they turned it around into one of the best teams of the modern era. I believe we have the team to do it too.

Considering (as a club) we've come from multiple wooden spoons, some enormous beltings, changed coaches, changed assistants, sacked our Coleman medalist (which in itself considering how structure was based around Fev and then bang he's gone, leading goal kicker for how many seasons?) we've not found a replacement for Fev since, and although we've picked up a bunch of first round draft picks, none of those picks have had to opportunity to be part of a winning culture. And THAT is the shining difference between our club becoming great again or failing miserably, missing our window and having to start from scratch again.

My money is on us getting it right with Malthouse, and our current list. That's not to say there won't be some changes to personal, I hope there is if it benefits the club. But to make posts calling player after player crap, no good, get rid of him, trade, sack and so on, I don't know what to think.
I'll go as far to say the only reason we won tonight was not for skill, not for coaching genius, but by sheer will not to lose another game. I see a deflated outfit out there on the park atm. They almost let tonight slip away - again. That isn't a skill thing, and it isn't a coaching thing either. Almost the entire list is suffering. Almost, with the exception of Judd who is old enough and been around enough, and is professional enough to not be influenced by the win/lose ratio, a true professional who creates his own form by sheer hard work and self belief.

If Malthouse can get these young blokes believing in themselves, you watch the transformation this team makes and the brand of football it plays. We've got the cattle, we've got the coach, we've just got to get some momentum and self confidence into these young minds and they'll do the rest.

Right now, they look almost shot. That song in the rooms was woeful. Got to get that winning culture back into the club at all costs, and FAST! before its rebuild time ....


You're right about last nights win, it was based purely on, "we aren't going to lose tonight" and I was happy with that, was glad to see them back each other when the argy bargy was going on, admittedly we beat a nothing team, but how often do we drop those ones, they showed a bit of mental toughness last night, still have a long way to go and there are personnel changes that will happen, but I agree we have something of a nucleus to work with, we just have to get their heads right.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 12:41 pm 
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Horrie Clover

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BIRDTOWN wrote:
marcou wrote:
Not surprised by Hendo performing so well up forward.....Remember he came to us as a forward originally from the Lions, we were forced to play him down back through injuries.....I'd like to also see what Luke Mitchell can do....and don't give up on Casboult.


He'd also played his game against Lance Franklin at CHB for the Lions. + he choked up forward when he 1st arrived at CFC and struggled to take a mark and kick goals up fwd. You may heard some less than encouraging support for Hendo in the past (unfortunately).


I would love to have Hendo play forward permanently, he has learnt his trade playing down back on some of the best forwards in the comp, which has taught him how to be a forward, rather than looking for a key position forward, why don't we go the other way and look for a defender.

It's funny Rowe looked ok last night with Henderson, played his best game, yes he run out of petrol but let's not forget that the kid had a cancer that could have killed him and what he went through to get over it has put his fitness base a long way behind.

Jamo missed Henderson last night, but having said that still did a serviceable job on one of the hardest running CHF in the game, I think looking for a defender to back Jamo up is the way to go.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:03 pm 
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Ken Hunter
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McInnes isn't that short. He needs to build up but he can do the job. The kid is quality.
I would love to see us persist with Watson as well. Give the kid time, just like Lucas - give them games and time!


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:05 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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Happy with a win.
Judd & Hendo our best. Simmo played very well.

Our fwds beat Gwilt & Stanley. Not much really.

Watson needs to do much much more. Correct me if I'm wrong but did he play on Lee. If so he was their most dangerous forward. And in terms of disposal Watson is good but also misses targets, point in case the last qtr pass that missed completely.

Nest week much tougher. Still need more from Murph & Gibbs


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:05 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

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edit

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Last edited by Blue Vain on Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:25 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Rod Waddell wrote:
Happy with a win.
Judd & Hendo our best. Simmo played very well.

Our fwds beat Gwilt & Stanley. Not much really.

Watson needs to do much much more. Correct me if I'm wrong but did he play on Lee. If so he was their most dangerous forward. And in terms of disposal Watson is good but also misses targets, point in case the last qtr pass that missed completely.

Nest week much tougher. Still need more from Murph & Gibbs


McInnes was manned up on Lee for most of the night not Watto from memory


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:46 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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RickJ wrote:

Rowe > Casboult. Gets more of it, looks like a footballer, marks at least as well, and can kick.


Rowe looks more natural forward. Casboult's played some good games, mostly when he's allowed to run around the ground more so than stuck forward. Played a couple of very good games in that role before the Sydney wash-out. As young blokes are they're up and down but worth persisting with for sure. Like to see us work on Casboult's rucking during the off-season. Could be a valuable 2nd ruck. Could be a handy "Leigh Brown" type. Rowe looked like he had the confidence finally to do ok at this level up forward, especially as a 2nd forward.

Like to see us play Waite and Henderson in the key positions and one of Rowe of Casboult as a 3rd tall 2nd ruck. Right now Rowe is the one in front after last night. That would give the Mick his "Pies Premiership" look when he had Cloke, Dawes and Brown doing the work up forward. Menzel into the side too like Sidebottom at Collingwood, back young blokes in the key defensive spots, ala Reid and Nathan Brown at the Pies, in our case Watson (this is the only problematic one of course) and the structure is the same. Mick would feel right at home.

Sounds simple.....just actually have to be able to play now. There's always the hard part...lol!


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 2:56 pm 
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formerly cj69

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jim wrote:
RickJ wrote:

Rowe > Casboult. Gets more of it, looks like a footballer, marks at least as well, and can kick.


Rowe looks more natural forward. Casboult's played some good games, mostly when he's allowed to run around the ground more so than stuck forward. Played a couple of very good games in that role before the Sydney wash-out. As young blokes are they're up and down but worth persisting with for sure. Like to see us work on Casboult's rucking during the off-season. Could be a valuable 2nd ruck. Could be a handy "Leigh Brown" type. Rowe looked like he had the confidence finally to do ok at this level up forward, especially as a 2nd forward.

Like to see us play Waite and Henderson in the key positions and one of Rowe of Casboult as a 3rd tall 2nd ruck. Right now Rowe is the one in front after last night. That would give the Mick his "Pies Premiership" look when he had Cloke, Dawes and Brown doing the work up forward. Menzel into the side too like Sidebottom at Collingwood, back young blokes in the key defensive spots, ala Reid and Nathan Brown at the Pies, in our case Watson (this is the only problematic one of course) and the structure is the same. Mick would feel right at home.

Sounds simple.....just actually have to be able to play now. There's always the hard part...lol!


Why not Rowe & Casboult forward w Henderson?

They can both relieve in the ruck, both work hard to create a contest and can kick goals. Having them plus Kruezer may be a good option. Henderson then plays the smart mobile key forward who we try and isolate.

Let Waite then go to CHB. Like Walker it's where he played his best and most consistent football and he is a very good match up for the Riewoldts, Clokes, Reid's & Kennedy's etc and will take a lot of pressure of Jamison. Very good third up and rebound player as well.

I think it would also help him with his longevity.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:11 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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ThePsychologist wrote:
jim wrote:
RickJ wrote:

Rowe > Casboult. Gets more of it, looks like a footballer, marks at least as well, and can kick.


Rowe looks more natural forward. Casboult's played some good games, mostly when he's allowed to run around the ground more so than stuck forward. Played a couple of very good games in that role before the Sydney wash-out. As young blokes are they're up and down but worth persisting with for sure. Like to see us work on Casboult's rucking during the off-season. Could be a valuable 2nd ruck. Could be a handy "Leigh Brown" type. Rowe looked like he had the confidence finally to do ok at this level up forward, especially as a 2nd forward.

Like to see us play Waite and Henderson in the key positions and one of Rowe of Casboult as a 3rd tall 2nd ruck. Right now Rowe is the one in front after last night. That would give the Mick his "Pies Premiership" look when he had Cloke, Dawes and Brown doing the work up forward. Menzel into the side too like Sidebottom at Collingwood, back young blokes in the key defensive spots, ala Reid and Nathan Brown at the Pies, in our case Watson (this is the only problematic one of course) and the structure is the same. Mick would feel right at home.

Sounds simple.....just actually have to be able to play now. There's always the hard part...lol!


Why not Rowe & Casboult forward w Henderson?

They can both relieve in the ruck, both work hard to create a contest and can kick goals. Having them plus Kruezer may be a good option. Henderson then plays the smart mobile key forward who we try and isolate.

Let Waite then go to CHB. Like Walker it's where he played his best and most consistent football and he is a very good match up for the Riewoldts, Clokes, Reid's & Kennedy's etc and will take a lot of pressure of Jamison. Very good third up and rebound player as well.

I think it would also help him with his longevity.


See what you're saying but i never liked Waite at CHB to be honest. Sometimes good but big blokes like Brown used to kill him. I'd be happy actually for him to play 3rd tall forward (HFF). Being out of the key position altogether might enhance his longevity further.

Waite Henderson Menzel
Betts Rowe (Casboult) Garlett.

Alot more potent.

The key is though is how good Watson turns out. He didn't look too bad last night, although some of the knocks people have on him from his NBs were there too. Then again he is only 20 and might just need confidence. Showed lot last year at times and seems to play better in the seniors than in the "twos".


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:17 pm 
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Horrie Clover

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Pretty underwhelming but better than another honourable loss. Hendo and Rowe were good. Saints have a rubbish bunch of defensive talls though so it's hard to assess that performance. Will need to see how they go against a quality defence. Hendo's inability to get separation might still be a limiting factor.

Watson could offer more than he does. Good decision maker and uses the ball well but compounds his lack of athleticism with a lack of urgency. Either that or he still doesn't have the engine for AFL.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:02 pm 
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Harry Vallence

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Bomba Sheldon wrote:
Rod Waddell wrote:
Happy with a win.
Judd & Hendo our best. Simmo played very well.

Our fwds beat Gwilt & Stanley. Not much really.

Watson needs to do much much more. Correct me if I'm wrong but did he play on Lee. If so he was their most dangerous forward. And in terms of disposal Watson is good but also misses targets, point in case the last qtr pass that missed completely.

Nest week much tougher. Still need more from Murph & Gibbs


McInnes was manned up on Lee for most of the night not Watto from memory


Thks Bomba. Well then Macca had his work cut out. Lee was their most potent forward. Who did Watson pick up?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2013 4:08 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Rod Waddell wrote:
Bomba Sheldon wrote:
Rod Waddell wrote:
Happy with a win.
Judd & Hendo our best. Simmo played very well.

Our fwds beat Gwilt & Stanley. Not much really.

Watson needs to do much much more. Correct me if I'm wrong but did he play on Lee. If so he was their most dangerous forward. And in terms of disposal Watson is good but also misses targets, point in case the last qtr pass that missed completely.

Nest week much tougher. Still need more from Murph & Gibbs


McInnes was manned up on Lee for most of the night not Watto from memory


Thks Bomba. Well then Macca had his work cut out. Lee was their most potent forward. Who did Watson pick up?


Tom Hickey?

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