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Blue Beatle
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:02 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Posts: 1392
Location: Hobart
ryan2000 wrote:
Well Rockliff is out..........

chose port because he wants to play finals - hope his judgment is as good as adam treloar when he chose pies over richmond because he thought they had a better list to win a flag and buckley who left Brisbane to go to pies to play in a premiership (only missed out on three flags at Brisbane the dummy!!!).

sucked in tom............

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trublu
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:21 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:12 am
Posts: 915
Why would a 27/28 year old wanna play at Carlton. Why would he leave a club that hasn’t played finals for years and go to another club that’s years of playing finals
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BoundaryRider
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:40 pm 
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Garry Crane

Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:05 am
Posts: 230
Although trading doesn't start officially until next week, you wouldn't know it outside Etihad Stadium. Just saw SOS and two of his assistants having coffee/lunch with whom I'm guessing is a Hawks list manager (had a hawks shirt on).

Lots of Dees, Suns, Saints officials also lurking in the area.
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99prelim
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:13 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
robertbb wrote:
trublu wrote:
robertbb wrote:
Fact: Bryce Gibbs father played till his mid 30's, and Bryce being similarly resilient should do the same. Meaning 5-6 more years of football by which time we should (we hope) be seriously challenging
Fact: There are no guarantees with draft picks, ever
Fact: This years' draft is not deep, and is nowhere near as good as next years'
Fact: Our midfield lacks depth already, and losing Gibbs to bring in a pick 10 will further weaken us in that department.
Fact: Bryce is contracted to Carlton, and given recent salary cap increase we actually have him cheaply for the next two years

I leave you to your common sense and forward thinking.


Fact is none of your facts are actuall facts


So:

Bryce's father did not play until his mid 30's.
There is guaranteed success with draft picks
This years draft is as good as next years
Our midfield doesn't lack depth
Bryce is not contracted to Carlton, and his salary is not cheap considering his worth to us.

:roll:


have you remotely considered the 'fact' that Gibbs will have more bargaining power in two years time.
That is, we have to sell the farm to keep him away from Adelaide's hands

This is not a fact but I'm very confident that Gibbs and his family will return to Adelaide at the end of 2019 (where he may well play well into his 30s...just not with us)

For Carlton's mid and long term future, we need to dangle the carrot in front of a vulnerable and confused Adelaide. His price is high. SELL!!

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famousblueraincoat
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:15 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 4:30 pm
Posts: 1832
Location: How blue do you do
Sneaky lurkers...
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Blue Vain
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:18 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17986
trublu wrote:
I hope this doesn’t stop us from trading Gibbs. I’d like to see us end up with the crows pick 10 they receive for Lever and go to the draft with pick 3, 10, 38 and 56 + kennedy and Saad



What are you giving up for Kennedy and Saad?

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99prelim
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:12 pm 
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Robert Walls

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 3561
Blue Vain wrote:
trublu wrote:
I hope this doesn’t stop us from trading Gibbs. I’d like to see us end up with the crows pick 10 they receive for Lever and go to the draft with pick 3, 10, 38 and 56 + kennedy and Saad



What are you giving up for Kennedy and Saad?


Pick 13 for Saad and Pick 14 for Kennedy

13 + 14 = 27
That's how it works isn't it?

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trublu
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:14 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:12 am
Posts: 915
BoundaryRider wrote:
Although trading doesn't start officially until next week, you wouldn't know it outside Etihad Stadium. Just saw SOS and two of his assistants having coffee/lunch with whom I'm guessing is a Hawks list manager (had a hawks shirt on).

Lots of Dees, Suns, Saints officials also lurking in the area.


The clubs are interviewing this years crop of kids in the draft
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robertbb
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:15 pm 
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John Nicholls
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Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:06 pm
Posts: 9354
99prelim wrote:
robertbb wrote:
trublu wrote:
robertbb wrote:
Fact: Bryce Gibbs father played till his mid 30's, and Bryce being similarly resilient should do the same. Meaning 5-6 more years of football by which time we should (we hope) be seriously challenging
Fact: There are no guarantees with draft picks, ever
Fact: This years' draft is not deep, and is nowhere near as good as next years'
Fact: Our midfield lacks depth already, and losing Gibbs to bring in a pick 10 will further weaken us in that department.
Fact: Bryce is contracted to Carlton, and given recent salary cap increase we actually have him cheaply for the next two years

I leave you to your common sense and forward thinking.


Fact is none of your facts are actuall facts


So:

Bryce's father did not play until his mid 30's.
There is guaranteed success with draft picks
This years draft is as good as next years
Our midfield doesn't lack depth
Bryce is not contracted to Carlton, and his salary is not cheap considering his worth to us.

:roll:


have you remotely considered the 'fact' that Gibbs will have more bargaining power in two years time.
That is, we have to sell the farm to keep him away from Adelaide's hands

This is not a fact but I'm very confident that Gibbs and his family will return to Adelaide at the end of 2019 (where he may well play well into his 30s...just not with us)

For Carlton's mid and long term future, we need to dangle the carrot in front of a vulnerable and confused Adelaide. His price is high. SELL!!


Cripps' contract ends at the end of 2019 too - should we dangle that carrot to the highest bidder? Heck let's get in early and hand over all our rising stars too... think of all "dem pickz."

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trublu
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:17 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:12 am
Posts: 915
99prelim wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
trublu wrote:
I hope this doesn’t stop us from trading Gibbs. I’d like to see us end up with the crows pick 10 they receive for Lever and go to the draft with pick 3, 10, 38 and 56 + kennedy and Saad



What are you giving up for Kennedy and Saad?


Pick 13 for Saad and Pick 14 for Kennedy

13 + 14 = 27
That's how it works isn't it?


Im hoping we receive picks 10 and 2nd round from the crows.

Use the 2nd round on Saad

And i would offer Macreadie up for Kennedy.

Go to the draft with picks 3, 10 and 38
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AGRO
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:34 pm 
Offline
Alex Jesaulenko
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:00 pm
Posts: 24630
Location: Kaloyasena
trublu wrote:
99prelim wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
trublu wrote:
I hope this doesn’t stop us from trading Gibbs. I’d like to see us end up with the crows pick 10 they receive for Lever and go to the draft with pick 3, 10, 38 and 56 + kennedy and Saad



What are you giving up for Kennedy and Saad?


Pick 13 for Saad and Pick 14 for Kennedy

13 + 14 = 27
That's how it works isn't it?


Im hoping we receive picks 10 and 2nd round from the crows.

Use the 2nd round on Saad

And i would offer Macreadie up for Kennedy.

Go to the draft with picks 3, 10 and 38



In what world do you send Macreadie back to GWS.

The kid is still 19 and he clearly wasn't doing well in the GWS environment, there are plenty of mercenary type players in the system that play Football Clubs on a break, Macreadie isn't one of them, they're not pieces of meat you know.

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trublu
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:20 pm 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:12 am
Posts: 915
AGRO wrote:
trublu wrote:
99prelim wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
trublu wrote:
I hope this doesn’t stop us from trading Gibbs. I’d like to see us end up with the crows pick 10 they receive for Lever and go to the draft with pick 3, 10, 38 and 56 + kennedy and Saad



What are you giving up for Kennedy and Saad?


Pick 13 for Saad and Pick 14 for Kennedy

13 + 14 = 27
That's how it works isn't it?


Im hoping we receive picks 10 and 2nd round from the crows.

Use the 2nd round on Saad

And i would offer Macreadie up for Kennedy.

Go to the draft with picks 3, 10 and 38



In what world do you send Macreadie back to GWS.

The kid is still 19 and he clearly wasn't doing well in the GWS environment, there are plenty of mercenary type players in the system that play Football Clubs on a break, Macreadie isn't one of them, they're not pieces of meat you know.


He is from New South Wales/ACT and was part of their academy squad.... so how was he not doing well in the Giants environment when he's a NSW boy?

Why hang on to him when we have an abundance of tall timber down back and he will not get a game before Marchbank, Plowman, Weitering and Jones.

The Giants lack solid defenders so do the kid a favour and send him back where he can flourish

and the last time i checked, this club has been nothing but mediocre and hasn't won a premiership for 22 years..... we are not a kindergarten

You cant expect to pinch players from rival clubs and give them sh!t back.
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AGRO
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:24 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:00 pm
Posts: 24630
Location: Kaloyasena
It was well documented at the time that he wasn't happy within the GWS compound environment, whilst in the GWS academy.


Also you want players to nominate our club, or for us to become a destination club you need to have a reputation of dealing with players in an equitable manner.

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Blue Vain
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 4:04 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 17986
trublu wrote:
99prelim wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
trublu wrote:
I hope this doesn’t stop us from trading Gibbs. I’d like to see us end up with the crows pick 10 they receive for Lever and go to the draft with pick 3, 10, 38 and 56 + kennedy and Saad



What are you giving up for Kennedy and Saad?


Pick 13 for Saad and Pick 14 for Kennedy

13 + 14 = 27
That's how it works isn't it?


Im hoping we receive picks 10 and 2nd round from the crows.

Use the 2nd round on Saad

And i would offer Macreadie up for Kennedy.

Go to the draft with picks 3, 10 and 38


The Giants refused to match our pick 47 for Macreadie. Why would they now take him for Kennedy?
I'd also be very surprised if GC accepted pick 36 for Saad.

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BoundaryRider
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 4:58 pm 
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Garry Crane

Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:05 am
Posts: 230
99prelim wrote:
robertbb wrote:
trublu wrote:
robertbb wrote:
Fact: Bryce Gibbs father played till his mid 30's, and Bryce being similarly resilient should do the same. Meaning 5-6 more years of football by which time we should (we hope) be seriously challenging
Fact: There are no guarantees with draft picks, ever
Fact: This years' draft is not deep, and is nowhere near as good as next years'
Fact: Our midfield lacks depth already, and losing Gibbs to bring in a pick 10 will further weaken us in that department.
Fact: Bryce is contracted to Carlton, and given recent salary cap increase we actually have him cheaply for the next two years

I leave you to your common sense and forward thinking.


Fact is none of your facts are actuall facts


So:

Bryce's father did not play until his mid 30's.
There is guaranteed success with draft picks
This years draft is as good as next years
Our midfield doesn't lack depth
Bryce is not contracted to Carlton, and his salary is not cheap considering his worth to us.

:roll:


have you remotely considered the 'fact' that Gibbs will have more bargaining power in two years time.
That is, we have to sell the farm to keep him away from Adelaide's hands

This is not a fact but I'm very confident that Gibbs and his family will return to Adelaide at the end of 2019 (where he may well play well into his 30s...just not with us)

For Carlton's mid and long term future, we need to dangle the carrot in front of a vulnerable and confused Adelaide. His price is high. SELL!!


A valid enough argument their 99Prelim, if you assume everything that you see and experience today in 2017 stays the same.

However, if Adelaide drop out of finals and into a rebuild by 2019 (they do rely on quite a few older players today), and our 66 game reset goes to plan with Carlton making finals (pt top 4?), in 2019, mindsets, including BG's will change.

I do have a lot of faith in this shifting of the guard and believe Adelaide's window will close quickly...much like Freo' did.
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carntheblues
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:44 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:05 pm
Posts: 2712
I agree with rbb, His points are better and in 2 years time Gibbs and family may want to stay in Melbourne.
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CarltonClem
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 8:50 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:26 pm
Posts: 4719
Location: Parliament House, Canberra
I'd think about offering North our pick 3 for their 2018 first round pick if we can obtain something reasonable this year for Gibbs that still keeps us in the top 20 of this draft.

It's a gamble but I think North could be a spoon side next season.

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bluebo baggers
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:12 am 
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Robert Walls
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Posts: 3489
Location: looking for a good bloke to have a beer with
Devon Smith to the Scum so put a line through him as well.

I'm not fussed about that - dodgy knee and all.

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trublu
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:49 am 
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Serge Silvagni

Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:12 am
Posts: 915
Our time isn't now and its not for another 4 years so I would still trade Gibbs.

Trade him for Crows pick 10 and 28 they receive from Melbourne.

Go to the draft with picks 3, 10, 28 and 38 + Kennedy

Our midfield depth is poor. We need to rebuild it with talented youth from the draft through the draft. I'd be trying to get as many picks as possible. Can we get a early third rounder for Macreadie from the GC or GWS. Its going to be a long slow rebuild but we will get there.

Docherty
Cripps
Kennedy
SPS
Cunningham
Pick 3
Pick 10
Next years first round
Zac Fisher
Polson

Short term pain for long term gain.

GO BLUES!!


Last edited by trublu on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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BoundaryRider
 Post subject: Re: List Management 2017
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:05 am 
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Garry Crane

Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:05 am
Posts: 230
trublu wrote:
Our time isn't now and its not for another 4 years so I would still trade Gibbs.

Trade him for Crows pick 10 and 28 they receive from Melbourne.

Go to the draft with picks 3, 10, 28 and 38 + Kennedy

Our midfield depth is poor. We need to rebuild it with talented youth from the draft through the draft. I'd be trying to get as many picks as possible. Can we get a early third rounder for Macreadie from the GC or GWS. Its going to be a long slow rebuild but we will get there.

Short term pain for long term gain.

GO BLUES!!


If this rebuild takes four years, Bolton won't be around to see it out.
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