Is it time for Wayne Hughes to go?

Cazzesman · **Posted:** Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:31 pm

Kouta wrote:

Bluey44 wrote:

And please, no more small forwards in the first round this year

Yarran is bigger than Murphy, so what makes him a small forward who can't play another position?

Why is recruiting a forward who isn't a KPP a dirty word in footy circles? :confused:

Who needs a potential matchwinner?

:thanks:

Yarran has more in common with Didak than Betts...

Hackenschmidt wrote:

It's perfectly acceptable/understandable for a young player not to have an impact at senior level in his first few seasons.
However, it is always highly disturbing when an early draft pick plays poorly at VFL level. For much of this season Yarran has played poorly for the Northern Bullants and it's had nothing to do with his level of fitness.

One of the essential ingredients of a good footballer is having the courage to go hard at the footy while keeping your eyes on the ball. If you are deficient in this part of the game you will never be of any use in a serious, hard game of footy.

Having watched Yarran closely on a number of occasions this season, the one thing that stands out about him is that he's, well, seriously frightened. So no matter how fit he gets or how well he settles into life in Melbourne, what he offers the team will always be very limited. He has such a strong dislike for putting his head over the footy that you couldn't possibly ever play him as a frontline midfielder. He does take a good mark every now and again but he often pulls out of aerial contests or takes his eyes off the ball, which pretty well rules him out of the backline. He has the pace to chase down opponents in the forward line and the skill and balance to kick some nice snaps and goals on the run, but when things get serious there are times when he will be a dreadful liability as he already is (at times) for the Northern Bullants. The ease with which the opposition wins the ball in his vicinity generates plenty of run and drive for the opposition. No it's not his fitness, it's his lack of a competitive FIRST EFFORT due to his instinctive lack of courage. Perhaps the club didn't notice something about Yarran that it should have.

You have a great eye for talent...

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Ouch! Still........nobody's perfect. :wink:

Regards Cazzesman

Synbad · **Posted:** Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:45 pm

Quote:

Synbad why use Braddles (He is a Carlton Legend who deserves better from you) and his outside game to win an argument against a bloke who has made too many outlandish statements.

Surely this bloke had many other bits of 'Gold' that you could have focussed on to score points. Braddles was not renown for being an inside midfielder. But he was amazing at what he did. So professional and lived and breathed the navy blue.

Does not sit well with me.

yes he was a carlton legend..... but physical courage ... wasnt his strong point...

....who is to say that yarran wont have a similarly great career... braddles came to carlton aged 21... yarran is being judged aage 18...

i have a problem with that...

dadadadada · **Joined:** Sun Nov 19, 2006 1:24 pm **Posts:** 1358

Cazzesman wrote:

Bluey44 wrote:

I am talking about the whole season and recent years, not just tonight's game - out of tonights players I only mentioned a few as questionable.

I don't think its an overraction to question his position when the season is over

Well lets see how 2008 compares to 2009 after the H&A season

11th to 7th
7 wins to 13 wins
1830 pts for to 2270
2014 pts against to 2055
90.86% to 110.46%

Someone must be doing something right along the way.

Regards Cazzesman

Cazz ... I get a different set of figures to you. I get 10 wins to 13 wins. 2217 pts for to 2270. 2354 pts against to 2055 ( a drop of 299). 94.18% to 110.46%.

Interesting when you look at St Kilda and the 2008 AFL ladder and compares to our season.

WINS LADDER POSITION FOR AGST %
St Kilda (2008 season) 13 4th 2126 1923 110.56
Carlton (2009 season) 13 7th 2270 2055 110.46

St Kilda (2009 season) 20 1st 2197 1411 155.7

This is what we have to aim for ... a big reduction in our against score. The saints achieved on average a reduction by 27 points per game ... just over a goal a quarter ... it can be done.

fraser murphy · **Joined:** Sun Jun 21, 2009 5:04 pm **Posts:** 1685

Hackenschmidt wrote:

The shrill denunciation of Roughead and Franklin can be explained by my deep, pathological hatred for the Hawthorn Football Club which leads to an irrational lack of objectivity about their players.
However, one point I will definitely not back down from is that Livo would still get a game as a key backman at Hawthorn. Thomas Murphy is very much a poor man's Luke Livingston, and anyone who disagrees has a very poor eye for talent.

I will admit that Thomas Murphy isn't much chop, but then I don't have a pathological hatred clouding my judgment. Nor do I presume that the Hawthorn Football department has a pathological hatred of Luke Livingston clouding theirs.

Cazzesman · **Posted:** Mon Sep 07, 2009 11:03 pm

dadadadada wrote:

Cazzesman wrote:

Bluey44 wrote:

I am talking about the whole season and recent years, not just tonight's game - out of tonights players I only mentioned a few as questionable.

I don't think its an overraction to question his position when the season is over

Well lets see how 2008 compares to 2009 after the H&A season

11th to 7th
7 wins to 13 wins
1830 pts for to 2270
2014 pts against to 2055
90.86% to 110.46%

Someone must be doing something right along the way.

Regards Cazzesman

Cazz ... I get a different set of figures to you. I get 10 wins to 13 wins. 2217 pts for to 2270. 2354 pts against to 2055 ( a drop of 299). 94.18% to 110.46%.

Ouch! Nobody's perfect............................as I have just mentioned :wink:

Stuffed if I know what site I got my figures from. Dodgy Bros.com. But you get the jist.

Regards Cazzesman

Gilly34 · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:12 am

badbuzz wrote:

Why would you replace Wayne Hughes?? If so who would replace him??

Has made some very good selections, and some that haven't come through. I'm sure his hit ratio would be as good as any other recruiting manager in the AFL. I see no reason to change.

The Rich and Yarran argument is ridiculous. I stand to be corrected but Rich had just over three possessions to three quarter time, sure he kicked a fantastic goal in the last, overall well beaten!! And his overall impact would have been less if not for some poor tap ruck work from Hampson.

The comparison between the two (Rich / Yarran) is simple. Rich is a slow midfielder with a fantastic penetrating kick. He is a matured body rookie, who is playing in a team which allows his effectiveness to be exploited when opposition teams allow him to play head to head. He is vulnerable when tagged (as others are) and then restricted in his effectiveness as he is not suited to playing either half back or half forward!!!! Would he have assisted our midfield, Yes!! But we opted for a player who will give our team three options of use. The versatility will prove very effective.

All players selected within the top ten a very good, they each will contribute in their own specific way. As long as Yarran develops physically into a stronger endurance player, his skill and versatility will make you realise why he was a better choice for the Blues, long term.

Should be bookmarked, stickied, POW :thumbsup:

Bookie · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:21 am

Joseph and Garlett were handy gets.
We needed rucks stocks which are hard to come by, Hampson played many games and was very serviceable, Jacobs looks tidy and showing plenty. Armfield, Robinson not too shady either.
Bower looks very good, Grigg looks to have Leroy Jetta covered. Yarran is really outside discussion yet.
It's just not an exact science and it changes as players and game styles go along, e.g Daniel Pearce, Justin Westhoff.
I'm not unhappy with Hughes at all. It's the use of his cattle that hasn't always impressed me.

TheBluesMuse · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:27 pm **Posts:** 5270

Gilly34 wrote:

badbuzz wrote:

Why would you replace Wayne Hughes?? If so who would replace him??

That dude from StKilda goes alright.

Definitely not the Pies guy....they're hopeless.

There's one definite trend amongst all of Wayne Hughes picks and that's how they are all "nice young men" perhaps let us show a bit more respect for talent....and just a tad less to being a "nice young man"...get the balance right.

Just throwing it out there....

JohnM · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:03 pm

If Hughes is obsessed with 'nice young men' (by which I guess you mean vanilla safe choices, stable homes, nuclear family, no history of getting into a bit of mischief... then the club wouldn't have picked up at least two players from last year's drafts.

So I can't agree with that one. I think it's more a case of Hughes having to completely and utterly rebuild the list from the ground up... and I reckon character-wise, you do that first by creating the core (which is made up of recruits with solid, reliable character) and to them, you can add the ratbags with rough edges; the flawed geniuses.

Take Geelong as an example. If half the list had the character of Stevie Johnson, they'd be hopeless. Because it's been the strength of character of blokes like Harley and Bartel that have made Johnson into a professional footballer. I can remember the big knock on Geelong during the early years of their current list was that they were too vanilla... not enough magic... too nice.

But I reckon recruiting-wise, they got the mix right.

Now if you're talking about Gibbs, Murph and Krueze... ok, but when you have the No.1 pick you don't take chances.

Besides, the club now has a dirty, rotten, mongrel streetfighting bastard of an eye-gouger in Judd, so that covers off that aspect of the list anyway :fight:

TheBluesMuse · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:27 pm **Posts:** 5270

JohnM wrote:

If Hughes is obsessed with 'nice young men' (by which I guess you mean vanilla safe choices, stable homes, nuclear family, no history of getting into a bit of mischief... then the club wouldn't have picked up at least two players from last year's drafts.

i mean the introverted, passive, eager to please and cooperative type of boys.

I also believe last year he was influenced more from Ratten and those at the club and that Mitch Robinson was recruited especially to address this issue...which i think was reported anyway?

I also believe Austin was recruited for Gibbs and Garlett recruied for Yarran....make life easier for our high picks being away from home....give them something to identify with...either that or it's just a silly cioncidence that I am reading too much into.

JohnM wrote:

Besides, the club now has a dirty, rotten, mongrel streetfighting bastard of an eye-gouger in Judd, so that covers off that aspect of the list anyway :fight:

Mrs Caz · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:04 pm

TheBluesMuse wrote:

I also believe Austin was recruited for Gibbs and Garlett recruied for Yarran....make life easier for our high picks being away from home....give them something to identify with...either that or it's just a silly cioncidence that I am reading too much into.

Pleasepleaseplease can we get rid of this ridiculous assumption?

If it was true I would also becalling for WH's head...and Ratt's and everyone else associated with drafting.

Gilly34 · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:10 pm

Krooooooooooooooooz is far from passive on the field

Gilly34 · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:11 pm

Mrs Caz wrote:

TheBluesMuse wrote:

I also believe Austin was recruited for Gibbs and Garlett recruied for Yarran....make life easier for our high picks being away from home....give them something to identify with...either that or it's just a silly cioncidence that I am reading too much into.

Pleasepleaseplease can we get rid of this ridiculous assumption?

If it was true I would also becalling for WH's head...and Ratt's and everyone else associated with drafting.

Give her a break, she's been around her brother far too long :oops:

TheBluesMuse · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:27 pm **Posts:** 5270

Mrs Caz wrote:

If it was true I would also becalling for WH's head...and Ratt's and everyone else associated with drafting.

See I wouldn't....i reckon psychology plays an important part in alot of things.

It's one of those things....I know it's a bit silly but I can't tear myself away from it...

I'm having a Libba....it's the feeling Mrs Caz.

And you Gilly! :smile:

I actually think it was one of my brainwaves.....Paf I don't think agrees with me...or he might on some levels.

TheBluesMuse · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:27 pm **Posts:** 5270

Gilly34 wrote:

Krooooooooooooooooz is far from passive on the field

They may not be passive with their instincts but i think in a group environment there is the risk of them going into their shells.

Mrs Caz · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:19 pm

TheBluesMuse wrote:

Mrs Caz wrote:

If it was true I would also becalling for WH's head...and Ratt's and everyone else associated with drafting.

See I wouldn't....i reckon psychology plays an important part in alot of things.

there's psychology...and then there is just plain stupidness (is that a word?

)

Cazzesman · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:20 pm

TheBluesMuse wrote:

I also believe Austin was recruited for Gibbs and Garlett recruited for Yarran....

If you believe that I have a nice block of land for sale at a great price. Sunny aspect with running water. :wink:

Regards Cazzesman

TheBluesMuse · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:27 pm **Posts:** 5270

Thanks Cazzesman :thumbsup:

How much?

Cazzesman · **Posted:** Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:42 pm

Promise you won't believe what you read on BigFooty from now on and it's yours for free. :wink:

Regards Cazzesman

TheBluesMuse · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:27 pm **Posts:** 5270

Now, I wasn't even a reader of BF for the Gibbs draft...and I came up with it independantly.....sooo I spose there is more than just the one person having crazy thoughts....

Then the Garlett/yarran thing.....well I was sold!

:smile:

Is it time for Wayne Hughes to go?

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