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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:37 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:37 pm 
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Horrie Clover

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:38 pm 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Now now people...on topic please. :cool:


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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:41 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:41 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Sun May 22, 2005 11:58 pm
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LosAzules wrote:
Blue Beatle wrote:
BlueLife wrote:
Well we could revert to playing the long kicking direct style that we did under Pagan. That worked really well for us and other teams struggled to work it out.

For mine it's mainly about the cattle, and while ours is improving it is not there yet. Stick a Nick Riweoldt at CHF and I'll give you a top 2 team and an obvious gameplan. We simply don't have that luxury. When our midefield breaks even or beats the opposition Fev and the other forwards like Fisher and Houlihan play well. When we get beaten in the midfiled our forwards look useless.



we've got a bloke called kruezer - why won't he do?


We could .... if we had a main ruckman fit to replace him. You can't take him out of the ruck until we have a genuine replacement ... people talk about Judd giving drive out of the middle, Kreuz gives us almost as much ... a ruck and a midfielder rolled into one, 2nd and 3rd and 4th efforts, huge tank ... this kid is amazing.

If Warnock can hold down the ruck, then he comes back and you move Kreuz to the forward line ... straightens the team up, we can afford not being so Fevcentric, stop punting it up onto the head of short forwards. Suddenly structure and game plan are praised ... sorry, funny coloured glasses right?

Problem with this is that Kreuz wants to play on the ball and he wants that because he knows his contribution to the team is greater.


I have high hopes for Warnock, but I'd rather we'd gotten a highly promising forward than another highly promising ruck. Of course, Hammer's development was in question last year, now it looks like 2 young athletic gun rucks is enough.

If what you say about Kreuz's thoughts are right, I agree. He has enormous value around the ground, as a marking target, a running option to receive at pace and kicking inside 50, and of course, a developing ruckman with exceptional ground level ability. If he can get his actual ruckwork to the required level his best position is ruckman pushing forward. Has the ability to play a lot like Jarrad Waite around the ground.

Having said that, I'd like to see him play a few games mostly as a forward to see what he can do...


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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 7:53 pm 
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Bert Deacon
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aramari wrote:
LosAzules wrote:

If Warnock can hold down the ruck, then he comes back and you move Kreuz to the forward line ... straightens the team up, we can afford not being so Fevcentric, stop punting it up onto the head of short forwards. Suddenly structure and game plan are praised ... sorry, funny coloured glasses right?

Problem with this is that Kreuz wants to play on the ball and he wants that because he knows his contribution to the team is greater.


I have high hopes for Warnock, but I'd rather we'd gotten a highly promising forward than another highly promising ruck.

If what you say about Kreuz's thoughts are right, I agree. He has enormous value around the ground, as a marking target, a running option to receive at pace and kicking inside 50, and of course, a developing ruckman with exceptional ground level ability. If he can get his actual ruckwork to the required level his best position is ruckman pushing forward. Has the ability to play a lot like Jarrad Waite around the ground.

Having said that, I'd like to see him play a few games mostly as a forward to see what he can do...


Think we only have to look at Q4 vs PAD last year and various other cameos this year. The guy is a great contested mark ... marks the ball at the highest point of his leap, straight arms, great timing and can convert. The thing about him pushing forward is that in that scenario he's not in position on the turnover so we lose his effectiveness. Agree, be interesting to see him play a whole game up there.

Having said that, you then rob Peter to pay Paul. Warnock may be the answer ... just won't be this year.

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Sun May 31, 2009 10:59 pm 
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Wayne Johnston

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I also thought Setanta was very effective when in the play. It's not an easy ground to play CHF, but he's done well there on 2 occasions this year. His ball use was first rate.

Really enjoyed seeing Gibbs as the guy kicking into 50 on a few occasions. It's smart tactics to have one of your elite decision makers and ball users distributing it in this crucial position. Would love to see more of Gibbs centre square and forwards. It's a pity we don't yet have enough elite ball users coming out of defence. Would be nice if Stevo and Gibbs could play further up the ground.


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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 6:53 am 
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Ken Hands
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Bit late ... but watched the replay yesterday ... have to say was pleased all round.

Great intensity pretty much all game ... real improvement on last week.

Think from comments after the ga,e from Judd and Fev said it all as well ... players were really dissapointed in themselves last week and wanted to prove a point.

Do not care what anyone says but if we bring the same level of intensity to Brisbane next week we will win.

Question in my mind is can the players do that interstate?

HUGE game next week ... probably most important in 2009 ... hope the players realise that!


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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:17 am 
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John Nicholls
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brazilbeliever wrote:
Bit late ... but watched the replay yesterday ... have to say was pleased all round.

Great intensity pretty much all game ... real improvement on last week.

Think from comments after the ga,e from Judd and Fev said it all as well ... players were really dissapointed in themselves last week and wanted to prove a point.

Do not care what anyone says but if we bring the same level of intensity to Brisbane next week we will win.

Question in my mind is can the players do that interstate?

HUGE game next week ... probably most important in 2009 ... hope the players realise that!


Well they have nothing to think about other than that all week.

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:33 am 
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Bruce Doull
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keogh wrote:
Melvey wrote:

And mark Robinson thought he wasnt worthy in being in the top 5 players on the ground
Absolute idiot


That was as stupid as his "Terry's Gone" article. He tried to wriggle out of it by saying Judd had 3 clangers :banghead: . FFS, he's worn like a glove by Stenglein yet still manages amazing contested stats.

Judd was probably BOG again - Robbo is a dick (Mark that is) Maybe he's invested highly in Ablett for the Brownlow :roll: .

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:31 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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keogh wrote:

And I know I am going to get crapped on again but Gibbs to me is a concern

Not enough intensity
too slow kicks way to short too often
not good overhead
opposition teams will eventually work out that he plays the corridor and will put a hard running opponent on him.
Embley ran him ragged in the third quarter. Gibbs tank will improve as he gets older. he has great vision but needs to work harder on his defensive game particularly hard running the other way. Not a star . Long way off it


Embley - 175 Games , 1 premiership, Norm Smith Medal, 10th year of AFL footy - May just be slightly ahead of Gibbs ATM - I wouldn't be panicking yet

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:51 pm 
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Rod Ashman

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darknavy wrote:
keogh wrote:

And I know I am going to get crapped on again but Gibbs to me is a concern

Not enough intensity
too slow kicks way to short too often
not good overhead
opposition teams will eventually work out that he plays the corridor and will put a hard running opponent on him.
Embley ran him ragged in the third quarter. Gibbs tank will improve as he gets older. he has great vision but needs to work harder on his defensive game particularly hard running the other way. Not a star . Long way off it


Embley - 175 Games , 1 premiership, Norm Smith Medal, 10th year of AFL footy - May just be slightly ahead of Gibbs ATM - I wouldn't be panicking yet


Gibbsy was on Channel 7 yesterday and he said he has been playing with a thumb problem for the past 3 weeks but is getting better.


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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:35 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:10 am
Posts: 4827
Jez1966 wrote:
darknavy wrote:
keogh wrote:

And I know I am going to get crapped on again but Gibbs to me is a concern

Not enough intensity
too slow kicks way to short too often
not good overhead
opposition teams will eventually work out that he plays the corridor and will put a hard running opponent on him.
Embley ran him ragged in the third quarter. Gibbs tank will improve as he gets older. he has great vision but needs to work harder on his defensive game particularly hard running the other way. Not a star . Long way off it


Embley - 175 Games , 1 premiership, Norm Smith Medal, 10th year of AFL footy - May just be slightly ahead of Gibbs ATM - I wouldn't be panicking yet


Gibbsy was on Channel 7 yesterday and he said he has been playing with a thumb problem for the past 3 weeks but is getting better.



Gibbs is still learning to adjust to the pace of AFL level...for a player of his abilities he can look intimidated when the game gets quick and intense. Looks a player who doesnt want to make a mistake and some of his decision making seems based on that....will go the safety short kick to an open man rather than be creative.
I'd like to see Ratten let him of the leash and let him know its ok to make a mistake and we dont expect you to be perfect...
spend some time forward, kick some goals, create some for others, just change his mindset and make him more procative
than reactive. Both him and Murphy look like they are still tied to Judds apron springs and someone needs to tell them its ok to do you own thing and be your own man....

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:51 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Pro:

Fev kicked 6.4 instead of 1.9 which would have followed his form coming into the game.
AJ gave Kerr no space.
Judd was Judd.
Back into the 8.


Con:

Medium forwards always seem to kill us.
Slowed after 1/2 time instead of burying them.
Robbo's report.

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:53 pm 
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Herald Sun columnist
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On that con woj, re Robbo, did you see the report and was there anything in it?

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 Post subject: Re: R10: Pros and Cons
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:58 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Haven't seen it.
Which reminds me.

Con:

Channel 7's coverage.

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