Firstly I never said finish bottom - and secondly if you can't see the difference between between Picks 2 and 4 and Picks 5 and 21 then thats your problem.

How stupid was Pagan in going for 10 cheap wins in 2004 and leaving us with Pick 9 and 25 (and I dont want to go through this argument again but I love Russell and Hartlett and both hope they go on to be 200 game players for Carlton). We could have gone for a Deledio, Roughead, a ruckman like Wood that we so desparately needed.


Give our current crop of players more credit to see where the club is going now with our off-field problems now sorted out. Why would Thornton consider going - not just because he had only played in 7 wins over the past 2 years - because he couldn't see any light at the end of the tunnel with an uninspiring coach and uninspiring president.

Why wouldn't you want to hang around our club now - even our new mix of Assistant Coaches have given our list a new vibe and you can get that feeling by talking to any of the regular posters here who go to training and see and hear the vibe.

No-one is going anywhere - and if they want to go it will only be for the dollars - and we know how we feel about turds like those.

Delusional - I wasn't actually referring to you Mordan?

But the faithful out there have got to see that good young talent might go down to Pick 70 - but the elite talent is around the Top half a dozen each year - and we have a chance to snare 2 of them this year.

No one said anything about tanking - we may not need to tank, but if we finish 15th with 4 wins this year and Kennedy has played 16 games at CHF and Gibbs has played 20 games learning the caper around the HFF and on the ball, and Bower has played 15 games running of the HBB, Russell has played 18 games (taking the Nick Stevens of the opposition ) then I will be far happier than that ludicrous Season 2004 where we got 10 wins (and I wont insult some of the players on that list because most were honest toilers) with players who were not really going to take us into the Top 4.

Rant over.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

We stop collecting Top 4 Draft Picks when the list we have takes us out of Positions 16, 15, 14 and 13 on the AFL Ladder.

Its pretty obvious.

It could be this year and that would be fantastic.

It might be next year not so great.

But the list (and its support) will dictate when we stop collecting Top 4 Draft Picks - not because the supporters say thats enough low finishes its time to move up.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

In reality you cant engineer a bottom 4 finish and still keep faith with your supporters, sponsors and players. Whenever you put 22 guys on the field (not all at once) their objective will always be to win every contest and the 4 points and it cant be any other way.

The difference being that the coaches shouldnt be focused on 4 points as the be-all and end-all of the game. Our youngsters need quality game time in important positions and this shouldnt be side tracked by pursuing the win. If we do that and end up with 10 wins , thats fine , if we end up with 3 wins I'll wear it. But the focus for this year should be development 1st, 2nd and 3rd.

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T E A M

fev- to kick 100 goals
fisher- to kick straight
playing list to take accountability for their onfield performances

Me too!

CARN YOU MIGHTY BLUES

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dane's trolling again

If trying to make finals meant that saddington, Bannister, lappin and Wiggins were playing most of the game every round and Russell, Bower, Blackwell and Hartlett were all playing bullants, are you still shooting for that?

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T E A M

Agro, love your work but you've been camped outside Spewman's office on the grassy knoll now for over 4000 posts. When are you going to take a shot?

most would agree, adding picks 2 & 4 to any list would be good.

IMO if we finish with 4 wins or less in 2007 then our list is not developing as well as it should be and we have some major concerns.

if the players we need to take the next step in 2007, don't take the next step, what will make them take the next step in 2008 (once we have added picks 2 & 4)

we have released most of the 'dead wood' we had on our list and for 2007 we have a list most believe we can work with effectivly and build a premiership around

adding picks 2 & 4 is a positive but will only be cancelling out the negative of our list not developing as it should be.

Indeed!

My wishlist is,

- young guys like Hartlett, Bower, Blackers, Edwards, Flinty, Raso get plenty of senior development minutes

- Pagan, Kouta & Lance retire with grace at seasons end

- we beat Collingwood, Essendon* & the Saints.

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There's so much I could say...

.......and the swans - our inability to beat them, annoys me.

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“It is a state of mind, a system of belief, a way of seeing the world, a deep faith that, because you are Carlton, you belong to something great.” - Mike Fitzpatrick articulating what Out of the Blue means.

..listen, what we wish for is our team to play to the best of their ability, and to improve.. ..if they do that and we win 4 or less and pick up 2 top draft picks, it shows that as a club we're as effective as the titantic, and sinking just as fast.. ..everyone likes to hype up the improvements and potential of the young guns.. ..but if we're so bad as to win 4 or less, we're just not any good.. ..end of story, and all the potential we see is crapola..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Mordan wrote



I agree.

2007 must be the year we start to turn things around and create an attractiveness for our lapsed members and new sponsors....premierships are not a guarantee for any team.

Strong teams will grow old and need to turnover their lists. Some trong teams will be hindered by injury. Anything can happen.

I'm still interested in picks #45 and #75 (ala Simpson and Fisher).

If we fail to win 4 games then we fail to win 4 games, but tanking is not an option for this once proud and mighty club.

I will be barracking for Carlton against the Tigers. In fact I'll be barracking for carlton everytime they step on the field.

I want to see us attack, attack, attack...the ball, the man, the contest, the goals, the flags.

I will always want wins....everygame preferably...but 12-14 will do me just fine in 2007.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

And aren't we fortunate we picked up these diamonds.

But you are just as likely to pick up an O'Keeffe at 50+ and a Beasy at 60+.

Odds are far better these days picking the eyes out of the first half dozen.

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"Hence you will not say that Greeks fight like heroes but that heroes fight like Greeks"?

Winston Churchill

AGRO wrote



And there's no doubt about that!

Perhaps we could trade players #45 and #75 for a first round pick, if we (as I expect) win more than 4 games in 2007.

Maybe Sheedy, Malthouse or Laidley would swap picks 1, 2 or 3 for those 2 Carlton players.

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Everyone looks good in Navy Blue

if by the split-round we've won 4 or 5 games out of 11 then i'll be satisfied...i think 8 wins is a realistic target to set, i'd rather set a target like that and win 10 times than set a target of 10 and only get 8...


hell flower that idea...a year where we come out at the other end of it with the President saying "we're happy with the way things went" instead of "sign up or we'll have to move home games" or "the players bought their own ice-packs to bring to training today"


Nic

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Cuck Follingwood

..bugger that, if we're really gonna be wishin', by season's end i wanna hear the big prez sayin' "gee this cup sure is heavy" as he lifts it high overhead, doin' a lap of honour wearin' nada save the premiership flag..

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..if you can't be good, be good at it..

Me Too!!

And Brycie and Murphs to start a scoring spree and a finish out of the cellar and the ability to put $#1t on the other people who've been giving it to us for the last three years!

$#it$ me to flower tears!!

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[Sam Jacobs] looks like a 7' Lance Whitnall, and [Mitch Robinson] looks like a 4' Lance Whitnall
(The SEN team during the Carlton v Cats 2009 pre-season match)