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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:34 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 14530
Location: North of the border
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:49 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm
Posts: 4997
Location: Melbourne
Dominator_7 wrote:
Bolton could just be our Brendan McCartney.
We need a Luke Bevo.


Pretty much what I’m thinking.

3 from 36 is a big enough sample size to show there is a massive problem.

We aren’t good, but we shouldn’t be as bad as that either.

Seems went from trying to be competitive in 2016-17, to full on development mode.

Think we need to find the right balance and realize winning games is an important part of development.

Mind you SOS’s list build has us every unbalanced


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:54 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm
Posts: 4997
Location: Melbourne
Sydney Blue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Agree, obviously if Bolts turns things around change tack, but there has never been a coach ever who has turned this kind of start around and become successful.

It’s nothing like Buckley or Hardwick. Buckley had never had the pies lower than 13th and always competitive and Hardwick won 6 games in his first season as coach with a side regarded as worse than our current one, and made finals 3 times before a down year in 2016.

Both of Buckley and Hardwick could of been sacked but no way were their win loss records remotely as bad as bolts.

Buckley never had as poor a side and club to coach.

Hardwick started from a base thought to be just as bad as us, recruited smartly and didn’t just load up on first rounders and banged up injured first rounders from 5 years ago.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:41 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2005 12:01 pm
Posts: 26567
Location: The Brown Wedge
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.


I don't agree. If you decide he's not your man, you move him on and bring in a caretaker.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 8:00 pm 
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Harry Vallence

Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:06 am
Posts: 1668
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Agree, obviously if Bolts turns things around change tack, but there has never been a coach ever who has turned this kind of start around and become successful.

It’s nothing like Buckley or Hardwick. Buckley had never had the pies lower than 13th and always competitive and Hardwick won 6 games in his first season as coach with a side regarded as worse than our current one, and made finals 3 times before a down year in 2016.

Both of Buckley and Hardwick could of been sacked but no way were their win loss records remotely as bad as bolts.

Buckley never had as poor a side and club to coach.

Hardwick started from a base thought to be just as bad as us, recruited smartly and didn’t just load up on first rounders and banged up injured first rounders from 5 years ago.

Buckley took over a side who had just lost a grandfinal, where did he take them, let me tell you ,backwards!


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:52 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:55 pm
Posts: 1223
The Duke wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.


I don't agree. If you decide he's not your man, you move him on and bring in a caretaker.


How's that worked for us in the past?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:58 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:55 pm
Posts: 1223
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Dominator_7 wrote:
Bolton could just be our Brendan McCartney.
We need a Luke Bevo.


Pretty much what I’m thinking.

3 from 36 is a big enough sample size to show there is a massive problem.

We aren’t good, but we shouldn’t be as bad as that either.

Seems went from trying to be competitive in 2016-17, to full on development mode.

Think we need to find the right balance and realize winning games is an important part of development.

Mind you SOS’s list build has us every unbalanced


Injuries or the fact we have changed over 50 players in the last 4 drafts and consistently gotten younger with less experience couldn't have anything to do with this?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:02 pm 
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Rod Ashman

Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:01 pm
Posts: 2586
jim wrote:
Rexy wrote:
jim wrote:
Ockham's Razor wrote:
Nobody associated with the club is satisfied with yesterday’s loss. Equally, nobody is satisfied with only achieving marginal gains over last year. However, to ignore the progress that has been made is to be wilfully blind or totally ignorant. There are plenty of both of these types in the media, kicking the Blues fills plenty of dead airtime.

Like all professional organisations the club constantly reviews performance. Make no mistake, all aspects of the club are held to account. All decisions are questioned and all performances, good and bad, are reviewed to see what can be done better.

Our club’s leaders are successful people. They don’t suffer defeat happily nor without reaction, nor response. Just because it doesn’t play out in the media doesn’t mean things aren’t happening. At this stage Bolton stays. To do otherwise would be reckless. Our club is not reckless.

As required, successful leaders change tack, invest more and as appropriate provide more support. Our leaders are the right people to guide the Blues to success. They are hard and ruthless when needed.

A decision may at some stage be made that a change of coach is required. However, it is equally likely that a decision will be made that stronger, better and more tactical support staff are required. The club is building for sustained success, not to be a long term mid table team.

I understand that a win would be great, however, would anyone have been truly satisfied with a 1 goal win yesterday? At best it may have kept the media at bay for a while but in reality those at the club would still be questioning / reviewing and analysing where the team and its development is at.

Cheers

OR


Changing the support staff with a shit head coach is like shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic. 3 wins from 35, 0-4. I'd be changing as soon as possible as to continue doing the same thing is worse. Didn't hurt when we swapped Pagan for Ratten. To keep turning out shit just hurts the culture.

We need to select coaches alot better. We've selected one good one since Parko. Since then it's gone rookie coach who had never played AFL, old dinosaur who was past it, rookie coach who had played and well, old dinosaur who was past it, rookie coach who hasn't played. Look at that and one coach did well. Not hard to guess, then we sacked him for an old dinosaur. Something we have been terrible at.




Changing assistant staff worked for Hardwick, Buckley and now for Richardson.

I think Bolton should stay but someone like Barker has had a long time with not much success.


It doesn't work if you head coach isn't good. Hardwick could coach. If he couldn't changing assistant staff would do nothing.


What a load of 'hindsight is a wonderful thing' comment

How do you know Hardwick could coach?

During the 2016 season, he had the big 4 plus many other seasoned players and probably came close to being sacked bc many thought he couldn't coach

Rich won the flag bc of 4 things
1. Astute recruitment to grab Nankervis
2. Martin had a year that will not be repeated
3. Their injuries were NON existent
4. Adelaide CHOKED big time (go back and look at the combined stats of Walker, Jenkins, Betts, Lynch and Cameron). Oh and did we mention the injuries to Smith, McGovern and Crouch

Apart from asking his recruiters to find a good ruckman, Hardwick had little control over the other 3

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:02 pm 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 14530
Location: North of the border
https://twitter.com/FootyClassified/sta ... 42592?s=19


Very awkward interview

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:03 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:55 pm
Posts: 1223
Sydney Blue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Good in theory but we are talking about the AFL and it always comes out. It would do more damage to the club, our culture and players if this was to happen. You would also lose some disgruntled key talent along the way. I couldn't disagree more with this dishonest approach.


Last edited by Sidefx on Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:03 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:24 am
Posts: 33900
Location: seaside
Sydney Blue wrote:
Steve_C7 wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Effes wrote:
FWIW, no team in the competition is currently averaging 100 points per game for the season (BRIS with 95.3 is currently the highest) First time since 1968 R20 that no team in the comp has averaged 100 points per game
Interesting stat and it sort of makes a mockery of those saying we have improved because the score against is better than last year

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Our % this year is 79 vs 61 after 4 rounds last year.

Higher scoring also equates to higher % therefore even this shows improvement
Pointing out % is really clutching at straws don't you think.



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COME on maaan...

at least get how % works...!


kindest regards tommi

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:29 pm 
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Harry Vallence
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Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:55 pm
Posts: 1223
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Agree, obviously if Bolts turns things around change tack, but there has never been a coach ever who has turned this kind of start around and become successful.

It’s nothing like Buckley or Hardwick. Buckley had never had the pies lower than 13th and always competitive and Hardwick won 6 games in his first season as coach with a side regarded as worse than our current one, and made finals 3 times before a down year in 2016.

Both of Buckley and Hardwick could of been sacked but no way were their win loss records remotely as bad as bolts.

Buckley never had as poor a side and club to coach.

Hardwick started from a base thought to be just as bad as us, recruited smartly and didn’t just load up on first rounders and banged up injured first rounders from 5 years ago.


They both never had to rebuild the worst list in the AFL either.
Buckley took over a Grand Final team, enough said.
Hardwick started with, Deledio, Riewoldt, Simmonds, Edwards, Richardson, Newman, Rance, Vickery, Tambling, Cousins, Martin, Grimes etc. Sounds more similar to our team now not 3 years ago. And they went 0-9 to start his first year.
Not sure what your point is when you leave out the important facts.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:30 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:56 am
Posts: 17491
Location: Progreso, Yucatan, MEXICO
Talk on the couch that he is micro-managing the coaching and overdoing the review process, thus confusing the players.
Of course we don't know but it might be an indication as to why players seem confused and their natural instincts seem to have been coached out of them.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:00 am 
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Trevor Keogh

Joined: Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:42 pm
Posts: 790
Location: dudley!!!
Blue Sombrero wrote:
Talk on the couch that he is micro-managing the coaching and overdoing the review process, thus confusing the players.
Of course we don't know but it might be an indication as to why players seem confused and their natural instincts seem to have been coached out of them.


ratts did that also, but when he learnt to let go a bit, we had a great year

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:59 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick

Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:14 pm
Posts: 4997
Location: Melbourne
Sidefx wrote:
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Agree, obviously if Bolts turns things around change tack, but there has never been a coach ever who has turned this kind of start around and become successful.

It’s nothing like Buckley or Hardwick. Buckley had never had the pies lower than 13th and always competitive and Hardwick won 6 games in his first season as coach with a side regarded as worse than our current one, and made finals 3 times before a down year in 2016.

Both of Buckley and Hardwick could of been sacked but no way were their win loss records remotely as bad as bolts.

Buckley never had as poor a side and club to coach.

Hardwick started from a base thought to be just as bad as us, recruited smartly and didn’t just load up on first rounders and banged up injured first rounders from 5 years ago.


They both never had to rebuild the worst list in the AFL either.
Buckley took over a Grand Final team, enough said.
Hardwick started with, Deledio, Riewoldt, Simmonds, Edwards, Richardson, Newman, Rance, Vickery, Tambling, Cousins, Martin, Grimes etc. Sounds more similar to our team now not 3 years ago. And they went 0-9 to start his first year.
Not sure what your point is when you leave out the important facts.


I still think the wins and losses don’t bode well for bolts no matter how it’s spun.

Mind you I have my doubts on SOS as well.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:18 am 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm
Posts: 5997
99prelim wrote:
jim wrote:
Rexy wrote:
jim wrote:
Ockham's Razor wrote:
Nobody associated with the club is satisfied with yesterday’s loss. Equally, nobody is satisfied with only achieving marginal gains over last year. However, to ignore the progress that has been made is to be wilfully blind or totally ignorant. There are plenty of both of these types in the media, kicking the Blues fills plenty of dead airtime.

Like all professional organisations the club constantly reviews performance. Make no mistake, all aspects of the club are held to account. All decisions are questioned and all performances, good and bad, are reviewed to see what can be done better.

Our club’s leaders are successful people. They don’t suffer defeat happily nor without reaction, nor response. Just because it doesn’t play out in the media doesn’t mean things aren’t happening. At this stage Bolton stays. To do otherwise would be reckless. Our club is not reckless.

As required, successful leaders change tack, invest more and as appropriate provide more support. Our leaders are the right people to guide the Blues to success. They are hard and ruthless when needed.

A decision may at some stage be made that a change of coach is required. However, it is equally likely that a decision will be made that stronger, better and more tactical support staff are required. The club is building for sustained success, not to be a long term mid table team.

I understand that a win would be great, however, would anyone have been truly satisfied with a 1 goal win yesterday? At best it may have kept the media at bay for a while but in reality those at the club would still be questioning / reviewing and analysing where the team and its development is at.

Cheers

OR


Changing the support staff with a shit head coach is like shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic. 3 wins from 35, 0-4. I'd be changing as soon as possible as to continue doing the same thing is worse. Didn't hurt when we swapped Pagan for Ratten. To keep turning out shit just hurts the culture.

We need to select coaches alot better. We've selected one good one since Parko. Since then it's gone rookie coach who had never played AFL, old dinosaur who was past it, rookie coach who had played and well, old dinosaur who was past it, rookie coach who hasn't played. Look at that and one coach did well. Not hard to guess, then we sacked him for an old dinosaur. Something we have been terrible at.




Changing assistant staff worked for Hardwick, Buckley and now for Richardson.

I think Bolton should stay but someone like Barker has had a long time with not much success.


It doesn't work if you head coach isn't good. Hardwick could coach. If he couldn't changing assistant staff would do nothing.


What a load of 'hindsight is a wonderful thing' comment

How do you know Hardwick could coach?

During the 2016 season, he had the big 4 plus many other seasoned players and probably came close to being sacked bc many thought he couldn't coach

Rich won the flag bc of 4 things
1. Astute recruitment to grab Nankervis
2. Martin had a year that will not be repeated
3. Their injuries were NON existent
4. Adelaide CHOKED big time (go back and look at the combined stats of Walker, Jenkins, Betts, Lynch and Cameron). Oh and did we mention the injuries to Smith, McGovern and Crouch

Apart from asking his recruiters to find a good ruckman, Hardwick had little control over the other 3
What alot of shit spin. I'll just point the scoreboard while you point to bullshit spin.

Fact is he rebuilt a rabble them in the finals in 4 years and eventually won a flag. Compare that with us.

Jog on.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 4:20 am 
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Geoff Southby

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 9:21 pm
Posts: 5997
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Sidefx wrote:
Adam Chatfield wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Teddy Hopkins wrote:
As I have said previously, you get nothing if you sakc in the season, if you must wait the season out.
Blues need to attract high end talent.
If you leave it to the end of the year players thinking of coming to the club or staying with the club will want to know who is there boss next year.
Let him see it out but have his replacement ready after the final siren of the last game.
Start the interview process now. Do it behind close doors and do it extensively.
Start acting like a business

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk


Agree, obviously if Bolts turns things around change tack, but there has never been a coach ever who has turned this kind of start around and become successful.

It’s nothing like Buckley or Hardwick. Buckley had never had the pies lower than 13th and always competitive and Hardwick won 6 games in his first season as coach with a side regarded as worse than our current one, and made finals 3 times before a down year in 2016.

Both of Buckley and Hardwick could of been sacked but no way were their win loss records remotely as bad as bolts.

Buckley never had as poor a side and club to coach.

Hardwick started from a base thought to be just as bad as us, recruited smartly and didn’t just load up on first rounders and banged up injured first rounders from 5 years ago.


They both never had to rebuild the worst list in the AFL either.
Buckley took over a Grand Final team, enough said.
Hardwick started with, Deledio, Riewoldt, Simmonds, Edwards, Richardson, Newman, Rance, Vickery, Tambling, Cousins, Martin, Grimes etc. Sounds more similar to our team now not 3 years ago. And they went 0-9 to start his first year.
Not sure what your point is when you leave out the important facts.


I still think the wins and losses don’t bode well for bolts no matter how it’s spun.

Mind you I have my doubts on SOS as well.
Our drafting has been pretty good. No busts yet. SOS has been good there. The side personnel wise has been built ok we just have a shit coach.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:12 am 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 13579
Blue Sombrero wrote:
Talk on the couch that he is micro-managing the coaching and overdoing the review process, thus confusing the players.
Of course we don't know but it might be an indication as to why players seem confused and their natural instincts seem to have been coached out of them.


The "talk" is coming from Tom Morris.
He is a shitful journo and consistently puts 2 and 2 together to come up with 7. Let's wait until it comes from someone with the slightest hint of credibility.

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Last edited by Blue Vain on Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:13 am 
Online
Ken Hunter

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 14530
Location: North of the border
You can see the process has started.
We are currently in coach protection mode but it is inevitable he will gone if wins don't come.
The signs are there.
Senior players coming out saying players need to take more responsibility
Rumors of tension between list managers and coach
Coach saying that the entire club is working through it.
Members of the board trying to justify the club's position.
Talk of some players not being happy and would be better off elsewhere.

Its the death march we have all been here before.
Malthouse sacked
Ratten sacked
Pagan sacked
Brittain sacked
Parkin moved aside
Jezza's sacked
Walls sacked
Parkin sacked
Jones sacked
Jezza's sacked
Stewart sacked
Thurgood sacked
Nicola pushed aside

All big names some giants of the industry all with better coaching records than Bolton.

Its only a matter of time
We are now defined by wins and losses.
This isn't a cop out any more

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 6:19 am 
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Ken Hunter

Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:35 am
Posts: 13579
I don't think anyone disagrees. If the wins don't come, he should go.
But let's see the year unfold and see if the wins come.
Commentating on his future week to week is tiresome.

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