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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:14 pm 
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Geoff Southby

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Steve_C7 wrote:
AGRO wrote:
aboynamedsue wrote:
AGRO wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
The problem isn't necessarily the drafting of midfielders IMO. Our issue is our drafted midfielders are still too young and slight to make a significant difference.
Dow, SPS, Fisher, O'Brien, I expect them all to be 150+ game players. The problem is Murphy, Docherty and Kennedy haven't been the more seasoned bodies to make the kids part players instead of the core group.
As I said elsewhere, I suspect Cripps, Murphy, Ed, Docherty, Kennedy and Lang were to be our midfield group with the kids playing a small role. Instead the kids are our main midfielders due to injury and limited pre-seasons.
Taking mids instead of De Koning or Schumacher wouldn't have solved our problem.
FWIW, I think DeKoning will be an inspired pick. He'll go past Harry at a great rate.




De Koning might well be an inspired pick - and go past Harry McKay at a rate of knots.

But the simple fact of the matter is we don’t have enough mids.

I’ve said it elsewhere - look at Geelong, they have Ablett, Dangerfield, Selwood, Duncan, Menagola etc etc, yet they their first four picks in the draft this year was more mids.


More mids in last year’s draft would not have made difference this year. As BV righty says, more kids is not what our midfield needs right now. .



The list is unbalanced which is Stephen Silvagni's fault.

I understand that more midfield kids in would not make a difference this year - but it will make a difference next year and the year after.


If you want a balance list in 3 years time, then you need the list we have now.

Talls take more time than mids, so by the time the talls come good the mids we pick up in the next couple drafts will make a balanced list in developmental sense.


Yes we are unbalanced now for that reason I think and we got injuries to mids when we have a lack of them at the moment, so 1-11 is the result.

Mind you if we aren’t going mids mids and more mids at the end of the season I will be questioning our strategy.

I’d try and give up pick 1 for 2 top 10 picks or 3 in the top 15


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:16 pm 
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Geoff Southby

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99prelim wrote:
Smedts and Boekhorst were prematurely moved on
Bad decision, shocking decision
They would have been handy now...not saying they were great but would be a marked improvement on O'Shea, Mullett and Shaw


Boeky I agree, he actually plays his 2 best games for us then delisted.

Smedts wouldn’t of added anything. Mature age mids should of been picked up instead of O’Shea Mullett and Shaw.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:17 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko
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Blueboy74 wrote:
AGRO wrote:
aboynamedsue wrote:
AGRO wrote:
Blue Vain wrote:
The problem isn't necessarily the drafting of midfielders IMO. Our issue is our drafted midfielders are still too young and slight to make a significant difference.
Dow, SPS, Fisher, O'Brien, I expect them all to be 150+ game players. The problem is Murphy, Docherty and Kennedy haven't been the more seasoned bodies to make the kids part players instead of the core group.
As I said elsewhere, I suspect Cripps, Murphy, Ed, Docherty, Kennedy and Lang were to be our midfield group with the kids playing a small role. Instead the kids are our main midfielders due to injury and limited pre-seasons.
Taking mids instead of De Koning or Schumacher wouldn't have solved our problem.
FWIW, I think DeKoning will be an inspired pick. He'll go past Harry at a great rate.




De Koning might well be an inspired pick - and go past Harry McKay at a rate of knots.

But the simple fact of the matter is we don’t have enough mids.

I’ve said it elsewhere - look at Geelong, they have Ablett, Dangerfield, Selwood, Duncan, Menagola etc etc, yet they their first four picks in the draft this year was more mids.


More mids in last year’s draft would not have made difference this year. As BV righty says, more kids is not what our midfield needs right now. .



The list is unbalanced which is Stephen Silvagni's fault.

I understand that more midfield kids in would not make a difference this year - but it will make a difference next year and the year after.


Perhaps he wasn't banking on Kennedy, Lang and Murphy being injured. This list is unbalanced so no mid's to cover that contignency

Perhaps the list build hasn't finished. Blue Vain said the spine was set

Perhaps we already have FA/Trade Targets in mind this preseason. We should have FA/Trade Targets in mind every season

Perhaps we for once were looking ahead at upcoming drafts when this rebuild started and are going to target our top 30 picks this draft on them. Good List Management means always looking ahead

Perhaps we didn't rate the mids from 30+ last year in what was seen as a thin draft. Constable was overlooked by many due to pace/endurance, Worpel kicking, anyone else? You want me to name more players that we should have taken at Pick 10, you seem to have a problem with that so I wont.

How does your combination of Fogarty/Constable at #10/#30 over O'Brien/TDK help the list balance to any great extent? Any incremental improvement is therefore better balanced

Perhaps short term bigger bodies were seen as hindering the amount of midfield time that Dow, Fisher and SPS would receive. Hence the reluctutance to play Kerridge and Graham early in the year. As for taking mids instead of OShea, Mullet and Shaw, chances are they were only going to be of the same quality of Kerridge/Graham, and only of a short term benefit. Dow, Fisher & SPS were asked to shoulder burdens in the Freo game that Cerra & Brayshaw weren't asked to do, as a consequence everyone is lauding Cerra & Brayshaw coming on this year

From memory most of GWS fringe players from the beginning were not midfielders - Cornes, Thornton, Brogan, Setanta etc, which more than likely fast tracked the likes of Treloar, Sheil, Whitfield, Adams. Scully and Ward were their equivalant of Curnow and Cripps. Certainly GWS mature body choices seem to have helped GSW junior development better than Gold Coast

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:37 pm 
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Stephen Silvagni
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We've never had as many good young kids on the list over the last 20 yrs as we've got now, IMO. It's gonna take more than two and a half yrs to emerge from the nuclear fallout left from past administrations.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 6:46 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:08 am 
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Rod Ashman
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Donstuie wrote:
Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.


Like it. :thumbsup:

It's funny how just after Malthouse the club talked about the need for a proper rebuild, reconstruction whatever and how this would lead to some pain over the next few years. IIRC most posters here were well on board with this. Not so many now that the pain is actually happening.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:47 am 
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Geoff Southby
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BigKev wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.


Like it. :thumbsup:

It's funny how just after Malthouse the club talked about the need for a proper rebuild, reconstruction whatever and how this would lead to some pain over the next few years. IIRC most posters here were well on board with this. Not so many now that the pain is actually happening.


Bullshit Kev..................we have copped the pain with little complaint.Trouble is the paint aint easing slightly but becoming damn excruciating and getting worse.If you are a fair dinkum supporter you are more than entitled to start questioning...............we got shredded by a team of newbies on saturday.That was pathetic...................only way to answer that is with action rather than talk.If ever there was a time to get us back on board its this week against the old enemy.No talk or flimsy excuses.Show it on the field.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 7:07 am 
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Stephen Kernahan
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Lifted this from the CFC website thanks to them and the AFL media section for it:

"The Blues are ranked last or second-last for goals a game, marks inside 50, inside 50s, disposals and uncontested possessions. The Blues' biggest strength is clearances – they're 10th in general clearances and equal-ninth in centre clearances."

Pretty depressing reading.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:36 am 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Blue Sombrero wrote:
Lifted this from the CFC website thanks to them and the AFL media section for it:

"The Blues are ranked last or second-last for goals a game, marks inside 50, inside 50s, disposals and uncontested possessions. The Blues' biggest strength is clearances – they're 10th in general clearances and equal-ninth in centre clearances."


Pretty depressing reading.



So we get the ball, but kick it straight to an opposition player? Sounds about right.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 12:39 pm 
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Rod Ashman
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Mickstar wrote:
BigKev wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.


Like it. :thumbsup:

It's funny how just after Malthouse the club talked about the need for a proper rebuild, reconstruction whatever and how this would lead to some pain over the next few years. IIRC most posters here were well on board with this. Not so many now that the pain is actually happening.


Bullshit Kev..................we have copped the pain with little complaint.Trouble is the paint aint easing slightly but becoming damn excruciating and getting worse.If you are a fair dinkum supporter you are more than entitled to start questioning...............we got shredded by a team of newbies on saturday.That was pathetic...................only way to answer that is with action rather than talk.If ever there was a time to get us back on board its this week against the old enemy.No talk or flimsy excuses.Show it on the field.


We must be reading different threads.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 6:20 pm 
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Mike Fitzpatrick
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Stone Free wrote:
Blue Sombrero wrote:
Lifted this from the CFC website thanks to them and the AFL media section for it:

"The Blues are ranked last or second-last for goals a game, marks inside 50, inside 50s, disposals and uncontested possessions. The Blues' biggest strength is clearances – they're 10th in general clearances and equal-ninth in centre clearances."


Pretty depressing reading.



So CRIPPS GETS the ball, but we kick it straight to an opposition player? Sounds about right.


EFA



Go you good things

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 7:37 pm 
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Robert Walls

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Donstuie wrote:
Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.


Not lamenting...just making the point that those we brought in a worse so we are in deficit

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 7:50 pm 
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Geoff Southby
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Posts: 5816
BigKev wrote:
Mickstar wrote:
BigKev wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.


Like it. :thumbsup:

It's funny how just after Malthouse the club talked about the need for a proper rebuild, reconstruction whatever and how this would lead to some pain over the next few years. IIRC most posters here were well on board with this. Not so many now that the pain is actually happening.


Bullshit Kev..................we have copped the pain with little complaint.Trouble is the paint aint easing slightly but becoming damn excruciating and getting worse.If you are a fair dinkum supporter you are more than entitled to start questioning...............we got shredded by a team of newbies on saturday.That was pathetic...................only way to answer that is with action rather than talk.If ever there was a time to get us back on board its this week against the old enemy.No talk or flimsy excuses.Show it on the field.


We must be reading different threads.


No.Same threads.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:03 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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99prelim wrote:
Donstuie wrote:
Things must really be the pits if we’re lamenting the departures of Smedts and Boekhorst.


Not lamenting...just making the point that those we brought in a worse so we are in deficit

Are they? And are we paying the same salaries?

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:41 am 
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Bruce Doull
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Rexy wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Last year we had a midfield that had Cripps Murph Ed Gibbs and Docherty was available we won 6 games.
To think that Kennedy instead of Gibbs was going to make a difference is laughable at best.
It is not the cattle it is what they are being instructed.
If those players were all fit and firing we would be looking at a 5 to 6 game winning season again.
We lost Ed last year and fell away.
1 piece of the zigsaw goes missing and it is season over.
Bolton and his assistant coaches will never turn this side around I don't care who you bring to the club via free agents or draft.
He is the new Mark Neeld .
You can see it week in week out.
What Palmer said probably was the closest to the mark.
The guy I feel sorry for is Cripps he is in Brownlow form and most likely will miss because the teams not winning.
I come across people like Bolton every day in business.
They say all the right things at the right time but ultimately produce nothing

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


Not sure you recognize what condition Kernahan and Malthouse left the place in. It's been vandalised for more than 10 years.

Give the new guys a chance at least to attempt a rebuild.


@#$%&! that. Bolton's leeway given by SB's expert business analysis is in direct proportion to Bolton's height. It's Bolton's own fault, if he wanted more time, he should have grown taller.

Simple.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:53 am 
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Alex Jesaulenko

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camelboy wrote:
Rexy wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
Last year we had a midfield that had Cripps Murph Ed Gibbs and Docherty was available we won 6 games.
To think that Kennedy instead of Gibbs was going to make a difference is laughable at best.
It is not the cattle it is what they are being instructed.
If those players were all fit and firing we would be looking at a 5 to 6 game winning season again.
We lost Ed last year and fell away.
1 piece of the zigsaw goes missing and it is season over.
Bolton and his assistant coaches will never turn this side around I don't care who you bring to the club via free agents or draft.
He is the new Mark Neeld .
You can see it week in week out.
What Palmer said probably was the closest to the mark.
The guy I feel sorry for is Cripps he is in Brownlow form and most likely will miss because the teams not winning.
I come across people like Bolton every day in business.
They say all the right things at the right time but ultimately produce nothing

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk


Not sure you recognize what condition Kernahan and Malthouse left the place in. It's been vandalised for more than 10 years.

Give the new guys a chance at least to attempt a rebuild.


@#$%&! that. Bolton's leeway given by SB's expert business analysis is in direct proportion to Bolton's height. It's Bolton's own fault, if he wanted more time, he should have grown taller.

Simple.


I was Critical of Pagan - Posters called me stupid
I praised Ratten - Stupid again - he chewed gummy bears and couldn't coach despite taking us last to 4th
I bagged Malthouse from the time he walked in the door - That was just Dumb
I said we shouldn't unload players even started a thread Ex Blues V Blues - I was a total idiot
Now I have been critical of the rebuild and Bolton - Well I have no idea this is the only way forward
There is a theme on this site and it the same posters over and over again that end up being wrong you would think they would learn over the years
Posters even call me anti Carlton because I question the clubs judgement

Take this post to the bank

As Long as Bolton is in charge we will never be any good

You run the site Camel - book mark it and return in two years

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:48 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Sydney Blue wrote:
I was Critical of Pagan - Posters called me stupid
I praised Ratten - Stupid again - he chewed gummy bears and couldn't coach despite taking us last to 4th
I bagged Malthouse from the time he walked in the door - That was just Dumb
I said we shouldn't unload players even started a thread Ex Blues V Blues - I was a total idiot
Now I have been critical of the rebuild and Bolton - Well I have no idea this is the only way forward
There is a theme on this site and it the same posters over and over again that end up being wrong you would think they would learn over the years
Posters even call me anti Carlton because I question the clubs judgement

Take this post to the bank

As Long as Bolton is in charge we will never be any good

You run the site Camel - book mark it and return in two years


We're all guilty of rewriting history at times, but this is pretty good. :lol:

You didn't have to look hard to find posters critical of the Pagan signing, or the guy who signed him up.

Plenty were happy with Ratts and wanted him to stay. Some didn’t.

Few were outright happy that Malthouse was signed. Some were.

Can’t recall too many people calling you an idiot for the Blues v ex-Blues thread. Generally, we just shared your despair.

That’s the thing with forums, there are plenty of opinions. Sometimes you end up being proved right, other times you end up wrong.

Not sure what makes you think you’re above the rest of us with regard revisionist history.

Anyone can be good at that.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:26 pm 
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Alex Jesaulenko

Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 2:15 pm
Posts: 20208
Location: North of the border
camelboy wrote:
Sydney Blue wrote:
I was Critical of Pagan - Posters called me stupid
I praised Ratten - Stupid again - he chewed gummy bears and couldn't coach despite taking us last to 4th
I bagged Malthouse from the time he walked in the door - That was just Dumb
I said we shouldn't unload players even started a thread Ex Blues V Blues - I was a total idiot
Now I have been critical of the rebuild and Bolton - Well I have no idea this is the only way forward
There is a theme on this site and it the same posters over and over again that end up being wrong you would think they would learn over the years
Posters even call me anti Carlton because I question the clubs judgement

Take this post to the bank

As Long as Bolton is in charge we will never be any good

You run the site Camel - book mark it and return in two years


We're all guilty of rewriting history at times, but this is pretty good. :lol:

You didn't have to look hard to find posters critical of the Pagan signing, or the guy who signed him up.

Plenty were happy with Ratts and wanted him to stay. Some didn’t.

Few were outright happy that Malthouse was signed. Some were.

Can’t recall too many people calling you an idiot for the Blues v ex-Blues thread. Generally, we just shared your despair.

That’s the thing with forums, there are plenty of opinions. Sometimes you end up being proved right, other times you end up wrong.

Not sure what makes you think you’re above the rest of us with regard revisionist history.

Anyone can be good at that.


How was it revisionist when I said it at the time ???
I have been saying it about Bolton - I stand back and listen to what he says - I dubbed him the Cliché Kid from basically Day 1
Right now watching last weeks effort you can clearly see his message what ever it maybe is not getting through
you have had plenty of digs at me in recent times I was just stating that just maybe I might be a better judge than some.
Maybe you are trying to create traffic for the site and I am an easy target

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:58 pm 
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Ken Hunter

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Should we start up a Sakc Bolton thread?


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:10 pm 
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Bruce Doull
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Sydney Blue wrote:
How was it revisionist when I said it at the time ???
I have been saying it about Bolton - I stand back and listen to what he says - I dubbed him the Cliché Kid from basically Day 1
Right now watching last weeks effort you can clearly see his message what ever it maybe is not getting through
you have had plenty of digs at me in recent times I was just stating that just maybe I might be a better judge than some.
Maybe you are trying to create traffic for the site and I am an easy target


It's revisionist to portray yourself as a lone voice on the issues you raised.

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